Coming to Terms with a Non-Verbal Learning Disability
Monday, November 27th, 2000
© 2000 Robert Cherry
cw527@freenet.carleton.ca
My name is Robert. I’m 51, live in the Canadian province of Quebec, and was diagnosed as having a nonverbal learning disability when I was 42.
As a child and adolescent I was a loner because I didn’t have the strength, coordination and social skills to make many friends. I was picked on by other boys in primary school and at the beginning of high school. In high school I found a place for some of my skills in the Army Cadet Corps – I taught Morse code, was a member of the rifle team, and became an officer. It was an ordinary high school, not a military school.
I managed academically in high school, college, and graduate school as long as I was able to avoid math and physics. I could not totally avoid math in high school and I got my high school diploma despite failures in algebra and geometry. In college I failed statistics the first time I took it although I passed it the second time.
I hit my first real brick wall when I tried to work after finishing a Master’s Degree in Guidance and Counseling. I had no way of knowing that a helping profession is much more difficult for someone with NVLD because of the difficulty we have with affective communication (reading other people’s social cues correctly and communicating the right cues ourselves). For about 20 years I went from one job failure to another. The little self-esteem that I had was destroyed because of the humiliation of repeated failures. My marriage ended because, among other things, my ex wife could no longer live with a man who was so depressed and frustrated.
I had the good fortune to know and work for a man who was very perceptive. He saw my learning disability and found me a neuropsychologist who tested and diagnosed me. The many psychotherapists I had consulted before took my money but did not make the correct diagnosis although I had no way of knowing that the diagnosis was correct. A few years later I found an article in the Journal of Learning Disabilities by Rourke, Young and Leenaars entitled “A Childhood Learning Disability that Predisposes Those Afflicted to Adolescent and Adult Depression and Suicide Risk”. After reading it I knew that the last neuropsychologist was correct and I had a non-verbal learning disability.
It took me a while to accept the label and the reality that I could not work as a guidance counselor. I had to identify skills that would allow me to earn a living in a very competitive job market. A 51 year old person with a negative work history has little chance of finding a job unless someone opens a door for him. Because of long-term unemployment most of my life’s savings are gone. I can’t count on my family for help – they either don’t understand or don’t care. The two government-funded job placement agencies for disabled people in my area have not yet been helpful. One friend who has business contacts (he is a lawyer) is trying to find an employer who might need what I can do and give me a chance to prove it. I can write, edit, proof-read, translate from French to English and do research in a library.
To scrape by (so far), I have been a member of a translation cooperative (we are paid by the word) for almost two and a half years. I do translation and proof-reading for the coop. The work is only occasional and, for this reason, I can’t earn enough money to live without constant worry.
Good evening,
I am 48 and was just diagnosed with NLD. After a whole life of feeling completely useless, a whole life of not being able to finish projects, of feeling alone and isolated, I finally know why.
I too am a translator. It’s something I love and I seem to be good at it.
I feel extremely sad. And I’d like to know more about how you integrated the knowledge of your disability. Can you make peace with it?
Thanks in advance for any advice you may have.
Anne-Marie
Bonjour Anne-Marie,
Thanks for reading the article I wrote five years ago.
While I am sorry to hear that you have NLD, I pleased to know that you now have a diagnosis.
My life appears to have been something like yours. The knowledge about my disability comes from the neuropsychological assessment report and my reading of some of the scientific literature about NLD.
I integrated this knowledge mostly at work. I now have a federal government job that I got through what is called in Canada, Employment Equity. You Americans call it Affirmative Action. I was finally lucky. Without EE, I probably would have become homeless. Since August of 2001, I have had a supportive work environment. I am only an administrative clerk but I make a good living.
Yes, I have made peace with my disability because I understand it and have a stable work situation.
I wish you well. Feel free to write to me in English or French.
Robert
Hi my name is Kristi and I am 29. I can totally identify with your story. I do have a learning disability and have gone from job to job almost to find my self on the street. I am so frustrated and feel worthless many times. I need to get a new full test to see, exactly what area of learning I can use and what I cannot. Math is a four letter word that I will never be able to understand and has prevented me from persuing my interest of further education. I have a degree that took me 8 years to finish (just because my mind works a little slower. This is the first time that I have come into contact with others who share my same understanding and hardships of life. It is encouraging to know that I am not alone. Thank you for writing about your struggle. Just reading your story has encouraged me.
Kristi
Thanks for sharing your story Kristi. I admire your courage in not giving up.
Neuropsychological testing may be the first step. If you can’t afford it, ask if your university offers such a service to its graduates. If not, there may be a not for profit agency in your city that could do it.
When you have the results, look for a not for profit (possibly the same agency) agency that will help you find a job.
Because you have a university degree and the Americans With Disabilities Act exists (I assume you live in the US), you should find something.
Please let me know if any of my suggestions were useful.
Robert
Hello, I just read your stories. I am the Mom of a 21 year old daughter diagnosed in 3rd grade with learning disabilities. Since reading further all these years and doing some research regarding another of my daughters, I have come to realize that my 21 year old has NVLD. She has coping behaviours that I am unsure are healthy, such as having to dance (more like rocking) and eating often. She was successful in High school, but when she went away to college, she became depressed, very over-weight and failed out. She came home and attended community college since last summer. I have taken some classes with her, which probably made her feel worse since I did much better in them than she. She has real trouble writing and has taken ENG 101 4 times, failed 3, dropped the last time before failure. I am at a loss as to how I can help her at this point. She has tried to find a job, but is apathetic about a job, (probably because of her self esteem). She has developed a new habit of telling me she is going to help me with chores, etc., then after an hour or so, goes “to dance” then never returns. When I inquire as to what she is doing, she become defensive and tells me she is tired or has done her work for the day. Is there any advice that you can give me regarding what type of job to steer her in the direction of, etc. She has been to counseling (last year) but felt that it did not help. She was also on several mood stabilizing meds and antidepressives last year, but is now off. She said they helped a little. Thank you for any help you can offer.
Nancy,
Parenting is difficult enough at times, even with the most “regular” of kids. Parenting an adult child that seems to be stuck can be very draining and one of the things I would suggest is to figure out your own support network. My wife and I have been through it with our 24 year old.
One thing that I might suggest for your daughter has to do with the type of therapy. While insight is always a good thing, therapy that is similar to what’s called Cognitive Behavioral may be more aligned with her needs. Some people respond much more to a pragmatic problem-solving approach, especially if “problem-solving” is part of the deficit. This kind of therapy has much more to do with the here and now, and may impact the behavior and underlying thinking patterns more effectively than focusing on the past.
Good luck.
I have suffered all of my life with something but I didn’t know what. Recently i have wondered NLVD. I am seeing a psychologist and she doesn’t think I am NLVD. She says i can make eye contact. I told her I am 47 and I am finally making eyecontact. I had a lot of anxiety with it when i was a child. I have changed jobs many times and havee had many,many relationships. Any comments?
Nancy, in her comment above posted on 6/24/06 described her child in terms very, very similar to my 20 year old daughter. In many ways Nancy’s daughter could be my own. My question for all who read this posting is how do I get help for my daughter, help that will be meaningful. She has seen therapists and experts who have fully diagnosed her many overlaid and overlapping LD problems, including non-verbal; however nobody seems to be able to break down my daugheter’s resistance and perpetual state of denial regarding her LD(s). We have just started with a 3rd psychologist since she was 12; he does not profess any confidence in his ability to treat. We have a first appointment with a psychiatrist coming up in about 8 weeks. As psychologists have not been able to get her on a productive life course, or build her self esteem, do her Mother & I dare to believe that a psychiatrist will be any more helpful? Finally, Robert, how did you actually come to accept that there was a “problem” in your life which needed “fixing”? My daughter is so far up that river Denial that she seems to be inherently unable to accept the help that is so obviously needed; obvious to her parents and to the professionals who have diagnosed her.
One final comment. My daughter is a carbon copy of my Mother and my sister (who passed away at age 54). I don’t doubt for a second that something genetic is going on here. My mother & daughter’s behavior is identical. Has anybody who reads this posting ever encountered evidence/studies concerning genetics and LD, especially non-verbal LD ?
Please write directly mgaynes@lawyer.com
Hi all,
I am a 32 year old guy living in California and I just learned about NLD through my mother and sister (both are doctor types). After reading some of the material, I have to agree that I suffer from NLD. I too am poor at math which has always hinderd my excelling at computers (I get to the math parts, equations, etc., and am lost), always take a toll on meeting new people, and like many others, have bounced around between jobs trying to find that perfect fit (I even saw a job counsler for several months to help me with that). I too have also been in therapy since I, gosh, as long as I can remember, and though I have overcome most if not all of my LD’s, NLD is still holding me back. I hope I can get the help some of you have.
Mike: I’m delighted you posted a comment here.
I don’t have a non-verbal learning disability (that I know of), mine’s the verbal type. But even with that difference we share some common ground. Most people who have these learning differences have had a rough time with school, with jobs, with socialization, with friends, with wives and husbands, and with self-confidence and these problems affect our lives in many different ways.
As one who has also bounced around between many jobs and passions, I can say that there’s nothing wrong with leaving a winding path behind as long as you’re learning and not making the same mistakes over and over again. I have to say, I tend to make some of the same mistakes repeatedly and I’m working on that myself right now, but for the most part the various changes I’ve made in my life have generally led me to more secure places and to better opportunities.
I have a very specific question for you: how does being poor in math affect your ability to use a computer? I’m not too swift with math myself but I’m very skilled with computers. I’m not sure I understand the relationship and was hoping you could explain further.
Thanks again for the comment Mike, hope to hear back from you soon.
I was looking on the internet for information on adults with NVLD for my brother and found this site. I think that it’s wonderful that people are starting to learn more about this and that teachers are starting to recognize it and catch it at a younger age.
Growing up, I never understood my brother. Although he was diagnosed at age 12/13 I didn’t gain an understanding of what NVLD means until we became adults.
He had a really hard time as a pre-teen and teenager b/c he was always socially akward. This made him depressed, paranoid, and suicidal. Getting a job at age 18 really helped him. I think b/c he knew and understood his NVLD, he was able to explain it to employers and co-workers. This allowed them to be more patient with him and teach him how to do things in a way he would understand. Soon his employers learned that he would be their most dedicated, loyal, hardworking, persistent, and honest employee. He has worked in the restaurant business for 5 years, starting as a dishwasher, then a busser, and now is a server at a world-class hotel in Banff, AB. For him, these are huge steps. His employers always feel like they’re taking a chance on him when they promote him, but he proves them wrong every time.
I’m so proud of him. He struggles but he is self-sufficient and he has lots of friends. He has embraced the fact that he is a little different, but that’s partly what makes him so loveable.
I think gaining an an awareness of how you learn and surrounding yourself with supportive people is a key element to being happy.
Tricia, I’m tearing up as I read your comment/post here, it’s touching and real and wonderful. I have an enormous amount of respect and admiration for both your brother for his persistence and work ethic and for you for sticking with him all these years.
By the way, I’ve stayed in the hotel in Banff Springs and it is world class. For him to be working there is a huge achievement and he should be proud, NVLD or not. The view from the dining room is so spectacular I don’t remember much about the service or even the food, I was just looking out the window the whole time (we sat by a window).
If you and/or your brother ever want to expand on your comment and do a biographical piece to be published at this site, I’d be very happy to hear from you (or him). You can write me at:
rwanderman@gmail.com
Thanks so much for taking the time to tell his story, it’s inspirational.
Hello,
I am a 19 yr old college student who is studying to become a special ed teacher. I also have NVLD. I actually just found this out a couple of weeks ago from one of my profs. I haven’t been officially diagnosed yet, but I am working on finding a doctor to test me. I am struggling a lot with the tests that I have to take for my classes. The thing is, I am wondering if I have the capability of teaching special needs students. Is my disability a hindrance or an advantage?
Ness: It’s possible to use your learning issues to advantage in connecting with students who may be having a rough time. It’s also possible that, depending on the way your issues present themselves, you’ll have a tougher time in meetings, in working with fellow teachers, and more.
There’s no way to know any of this before you give it a try. If you continue toward becoming a teacher you’ll have a better sense of this during your practicum year(s) and you can make necessary adjustments (if needed) then.
I have a verbal learning disability and taught at the University level for many years. I was good, no problems at all. I spent two years teaching in a high school and while others thought I did a great job, I didn’t like the way I was teaching and I found a classroom full of LD kids tough (for me). I’m a fine teacher, but less fine at behavior management. Teaching kids will involve at least some behavior management skills as well as content mastery.
The saying “know thyself” is right on the money. I went back to university teaching and was happy and more effective. My wife teaches high school kids with learning issues and she loves it and her students love her. She does not have a learning disability although she does query me for information about my experience to use in her classroom.
Bottom line: I know a lot about learning disabilities having spent my entire life with one as well as having made a career in the area of learning disabilities and technology, but these things don’t necessarily make me a good classroom teacher of LD kids. They don’t hurt, they just don’t clinch it.
Richard: Poor math skills affect computer skills as so far as programming such as Java, JavaScript, C++, and Flash.
Mike: Absolutely, in your comment above you didn’t make clear that you were talking about programming, I assumed you were talking about simply using a computer, like you’re doing now. Programmers need decent math skills, or, they at least need to know how to use a computer to support weak math skills.
There are dyslexic programmers and believe it or not I’ve written a few programs in my time without decent math skills. I’m no great programmer but I did make and sell a line of software for many years.
I am 47 and had my NLD diagnosed four years ago. I still struggle with it greatly on a daily basis. My job history is very sporadic because of my LD; and this fact greatly overshadows my trying to procure a job now. Even though it is not my fault, my poor work background is held against me constantly.
Thanks for sharing your experience Diane.
Before you had the label NLD what did you think was going on with yourself? I’m curious how having the label has changed things for you, maybe helped you give yourself some more space to operate in.
For some folks the label is useful and for others it can be a problem in that it holds them back.
As for how others view either a pattern of behavior or a work history, the label can be both useful for them and also a problem in that we are not our labels, we’re a lot more.
Can you describe how your poor work background is held against you?
I have read all the above stories with great interest as I have a 18 yr old daughter entering her freshmen year this fall. She was diagnosed as a child with a learning disabitlity but only a couple of years ago was I told it was a non verbal learning disability. She has friends but is socially awkward.She never calls anyone and always waits for someone else to initiate the social activities. She described her awkwardness to the person administering the test as being “klutzy”. She is a perfectionist and the hardest working kid I have ever seen. She has a lot of trouble with abstract thinking, working memory,writing and understanding complex directions. She is the only one of her friends not attending the senior prom but I think she is relieved she does not have to go. She has excelled in high school because of her amazing memory and determination. She was on National Honor Society and graduated with a 3.9 GPA.Life must be stressful for her though and she is so driven to perfectionism. I am really worried about her going off to college in another state and not knowing a soul since she is so socially awkward. I wonder how those of you that went to college managed socially with all the peer pressure of drugs and alcohol and low self esteem? I am encouraging her to find a job this summer but I think she is lacking the self esteem to do so.
I am writing on behalf of our daughter, Suzannah, who has recently been diagnosed with NvLD. She is 26 and has had a very lonely life. We , as parents, are finding it extremely hard to cope with her as she has temper tantrums and is very unhappy.
It would be great if she could talk to somebody who also has NvLD. We live in France so she can reply in English or French. I have given her email address, if anyone wishes to talk to us as well our email address is john.forbes@orange.fr
Hi everyone, I am a 51 yr old woman living in Ontario Canada. I was never formally diagnosed with NLD – had some testing done in the 80′s that revealed a wide gap between my verbal & performance I.Q.’s but NLD wasn’t even on the radar back then. Its comforting to know that many of us struggle with similar proglems. I am very lucky to have a job that I enjoy and can manage – although I work very hard to keep up I am very much a loner – making friends has been difficult over the years – not sure why! And after all these years I still bump into things, can’t multi task and get lost in space! LOL However, I try not to worry too much about the things I can’d do well and enjoy what I can do. The internet has been very helpful in increasing my knowledge about NLD
Jackie I read the e-mail you posted in July about your 18 year old daughter and I would like to talk to you about NLD. My son Matt has NLD and he is a high school senior this Fall 2007. He wants also to attend a college out of state. He currently has a GPA 3.8 and with accomodations over the years as done very well in school. I worry that he does not have any close friends and he seems uncomfortable with people he does not know. He has had a parttime job for 2 years and has done well. I am concerned about him going off to college but he really wants to go and continues to say I can do it. Not having alot of friends doesn’t bother him. His aunt and grandparents live very close to the school he wants to attend so that does help. Please e-mail me if you would like to talk.
Jackie,
As I read your profile of your daughter, I feel like I am exactly like her.
I have problems with visual spatial, working memory, abstract reasoning, etc.
When I graduated from highschool I graduated within the top of my class. This was accomplished through shear determination. I didn’t go to my prom either.
When I went to college though, it was extremely different. I barely passed.
I would recommend to your daughter to get as much accomodation as she can in her classes, such as longer testing periods. And, to take a reduced courseload, so she can adjust to the new settings of college.
I am in Civil Engineering, and this longer testing time makes the difference between passing and failing courses.
For the social difficulties, that will be difficult. She will need a lot of support from her family to get through the first year (the toughest). Good luck! Let me know if you need anything.
Hi, I have a son named Joshua who has been diagnosed with Aspergers but after finding info on NVLD, I have come to realize that the Aspergers diagnosis is incorrect. He basically has fine motor, spatial and social issues. He is 14, does fine academically, maintaining A or B’s in school, he is in 8th grade in a private school, small class setting, but know that if not for his good memory, the grades would not be as good. I understand his disability so do not make him do things such as go to a dance, where it is too loud. Luckily he has had an awesome best friend and a couple of others due to his love of the computer games, playstation, etc. but never calls kids on his own. My question is not in his teenage years, (I know he won’t be popular, but I make him do karate, we have a big family, and he has a couple of friends, not very social though, so he keeps busy, but I am worried about college. We will make it through high school. What kind of a degree should he go for? What kind of jobs can NVLD kids do? Does any know of book related to that topic? How do I get him to be self sufficient? He has never had behavior problems, but he does get anxious about situations. Any advice. I also want to add that I feel really sorry for all the adults that were diagnosed so late in life. I know that the amount of situations Josh has been in, that my husband and I have always used humour and told him that he is just as smart as everyone else, but he will take longer to do things, but once he gets it, he gets it. His self esteem seems to be fine because of this. Any info on colleges, early adult hood, etc. would be helpful.
Carole,
I”m not sure how much it matters now, but what makes you lean towards NVLD and not Aspergers?
You say, “if not for his good memory, the grades would not be as good,” I guess you mean that rote memory skills are more of a strength than “novel thinking.” Well, go with his strengths. Everyone plays the game of achieving good grades differently. Better to learn his strengths now than later.
If he keeps up good work habits, develops his strengths and interests further and works on some challenges, social and organizational for example, then there’s no reason he couldn’t find his niche in college and do quite well. There are more and more colleges becoming sensitized to the type of support and mentoring that people with NVLD or Aspergers need on a college campus.
For starters you might read through “Bridging the Gap” by Rondalyn Whitney. She’s a friend of mine and an awesomme lady who’s a top notch occupational therapist and is raising a teenager with Non Verbal Learning Disabilities.
I have a 22 year old daughter with non verbal learning disability and attention deficit. I have always had problems with my daughter. Since she was born she threw raging fits (abnormal), she has always been very rebellious and out of control. I had to home school her because she wouldn’t go to school. She started community college and was diagnosed with the the above diagnosis’. She got through everything in her first two years except for her maths. She couldn’t even make it past math 70. Since she couldn’t go any further with typical studies, she took a 6 month course in massage therapy. She was very successful with massage therapy and enjoyed it very much but she can’t seem to pass the national exam. I am constantly struggling to help my daughter become a responsible and happy adult but can’t seem to get very far. The one thing that has helped tremendously is to eliminate preservatives, MSG, artificial colors, etc. from her diet. I stock her pantry with organic healthy foods, lots of organic fresh fruits and veggies and meats with no hormones. I have actually seen this diet completely change some kids behaviors and personalities. It’s worth a try. Read Dr. Doris Rapp’s book “Is This Your Child?”
To Jackie and Terri….I think it is very possible for NLD kids to be successful in college if they have the necessary supports in place at school before they go. It is also important that they are willing to call you for ideas on how to handle certain situations and then listen to your suggestions….LOL. Email me if you want to talk more.
Hi,
First of all i would like to thank everyone for sharing in a public forum. It is most helpful, I have just had my son diagnosed with NLD (8 year old). He is an extremely bright, intellectually stimulated boy. He also has all the physical awkwardness and social difficulties that are typical of this disorder accompanied by a sense of humor that is evolved and almost adult-like. He is also at an age where he can articulate and tell you how he differs from his classmates…having a diagnosis for him to understand more about why things are the way they are is a huge relief.
I had anticipated ADHD as the ‘worst case’ scenario when i had him evaluated i am somewhat overwhelmed by the wide spectrum of issues associated with this disorder. I am also crestfallen by the possibility that this disability may seriously comprimise his ability to have a fulfilled adult life.
I had requested an evaluation from his school, my request was denied because he is able to maintain grade level academics. So i had him independently evaluated and now we’re here.
I want to know if anyone is aware of children’s support groups in the Greater Washington DC area. It would be great for him to meet other children more like him…highly verbose well read know it all kids!
I am also eager to learn more about what i should be doing when developing his IEP…Public versus private schools? I am warry of LD schools because they seem to cater more to kids with verbal disorders or ADD…i have been researching as much as i can on my own. Besides the Lab School…I am not aware of specific schools in my area that address NLD.
Any input would be helpful – we live in Northern VA.
Thank you&
Best regards,
Nataly
Hi Nataly. I wouldn’t get automatically overwhelmed as you put it, “by the wide spectrum of issues associated with this disorder.” Let the diagnosis enable you to get informed but keep in mind that the reason there’s such a wide spectrum of issues is that NVLD means different challenges for different people. The descriptions in the literature are necessarily wide in order to cover all the variations. While there is a syndrome or consistent group of performance issues, not everyone manifests this in the same way.
Similarly, the idea that this “disability may seriously comprimise his ability to have a fulfilled adult life” is overstating the situation. I don’t know your child and the difficulties he faces, but having NVLD, characterized in his case (as you put it), by being highly verbose, socially awkward and with certain fine motor or visual spatial weaknesses, can still lead to a highly productive fullfilling life. It’s a description of a learning profile with strengths and weaknesses, not a sentence.
Having said all that
I do recognize that when you first get news of disagnostic significance it can and often is overwhelming. Two books that may help are “Bridging the Gap” and “The Sourcebook for Non Verbal Learning Disorders.” The first one is written by Rondalyn Whitney, an amazing woman and a friend of mine. She’s raising a son with non verbal learning disabilities and has been one of the leading occupational therapists that specialize in NVLD. Her book is a vivid description written about her experiences with her son, a non-technical read and for many people, inspiring. The second one, The Sourcebook written by Sue Thompson, is widely read by professionals and is more technical and wide-ranging. Both can be helpful.
Good luck with everything and keep in touch.
Sanford
I am living in Edmonton AB
My Education is a mess, I am
24 years old and I have foundan
no help to bright my Education gaps. I new how to read, but not how to spell. I have gaps from gr 3 to gr 12, I know I want to be a nurse but where do I go to filled in these gaps? Also how do I get collages to respect me, they clam that my support makes the class room not fair for others.
Adam: The first thing I’d do is find someone to help you sort things out: a therapist or a social worker or a support group or anyone with knowledge of adults with learning issues.
The next step might be to get tested so that you have a better idea what your strengths and weaknesses are and how you best learn.
With the knowledge that can come from the testing you can make a plan to fill in the gaps in your education and improve your spelling. It will take some time but you’re young and the time will be well spent and will help you for the rest of your life.
There is no reason you can’t go to nursing school and become a nurse. You just need a plan to get you from where you are now to that end. And, you can do it.
Let us know if you need help finding resources in Edmonton, we don’t have a lot of Canadian resources on this web site but we can do some searching for you.
Here’s a resource that might help you get started:
The Learning Disabilities Association of Alberta
Edmonton Chapter
5540 – 106 Ave. (St. Gabriel’s School)
Edmonton, Alberta
Canada T6A 1G3
(780) 466-1011
www.ldaa-ec.ca/
This is to Adam. I am a 22 year old girl with NLD living in Missouri. I am currently going to school in Kentucky and will graduate with teaching degree in special education next winter. I did not receive any extra accomodations until college. Now I have extended time for tests and a distraction free environment. I had to advocate for myself and explain to the college that without these accomodations, I could be as successful. When you have a learning disability, getting support in the classroom does not “make it unfair for others” as you say that your college claims. what is does is level the playing field by giving you a boost. True, the other students in the class are expected to be successful without support, but they also do not have to deal with the same disability that you do. You need to somehow explain this to the college. I recomend finding someone who will help you out with this and help you advocate for yourself in this situation. It is totally possible for you to earn your degree in nursing if you really work at it and have the right support. It might take a bit longer than usuall, don’t be discouraged.
I am the mother of a 24 year old son who was diagnosed with NVLD about 2 years ago. Although all the signs were there from the time he was alittle boy, I amazed it took over 20 years to diagnose it.
My son Tom struggled all through school academically and socially. While he struggled with math & science, he excelled in english and social studies.
After high school he attended a community college in our area while trying to decide what he wanted to pursue. After failing or dropping several math & science classes, I urged him to contact the student services department to find out what to do. they are the ones that suggested having him tested.
He was diagnosed with NVLD in January of 2006. While at the community college he decided he wanted to major in elementary edication. He did very well in the classes he took for elementary ed. Inspite of his disability, he got accepted at a private college in our area. This proved to be a mistake early on. After his first year (2006-2007) he was put on academic probation. After working with his advisor, he felt he had a good plan for the coming year.
We found out yesterday that he has been dismissed. He had a meeting with the staff and presented a plan that had been worked out with an LD specialist. Classes had been selected that he would be successful in to complete the year. We knew he would not be able to continue after this year, but were hoping he could finish out this year. The staff has decided to let the dismissal stand.
His disability has been well documented from the 1st moment we set foot on the campus. Despite meetings with advisors and the disability coordinator at the school, not once did anyone ever tell us the school was not equipted to deal ith this type of LD. Of course due to all the privacy stuff, they won’t really tell me anything, even when he and I have gone to meetings together and he has given his permission. It’s all a big secret!
We found out about 3 weeks ago that there is a book that lists all the colleges in the US that are equipted to deal with LD’s of this nature. If only we had know about this 2 years ago, we could have saved a lot of time, money and missery.
The book lists a few schools in our area that we are going to check into.
While we received the diagnosis 2 years ago, we didn’t really realize how severe it is until 3 weeks ago. No one we know knows much about it and there fore it’s hard to find support or helpful info.
I have read many of the entries listed and found them quite helpful. It’s nice to know there are more people out there dealing with this too. I’m going to get one of the books listed by Nataly (12/17/07 entry) and will check into the other resources that people have mentioned.
To Nataly,
I just posed an entry describing what we have been through in the last 2 years. I can relate to your entry. As I said in my entry, my son wasn’t diagnosed until he was 22 years old. We always suspected something wasn’t right. But got no where with testing. He always excelled in other academic areas, so an LD wasn’t suspected. Now that I’ve read more about it, the pieces all fit together. He really struggled in social situations and really does better with younger or older people. He seems to struggle with peers. My son also has a great sense of humor like your boy. He can be extreamly funny and has a quick wit. As funny as he can be, he can turn quickly into a bad mood and he can be mean. Does this happen with your boy? I don’t think he even realizes what is happening. I think this is where the Asperger syndrom comes into play. He exibited some of those tendancies as a young child, which I still see from time to time. Other people don’t know what the deal is and just figure he’s a jerk. He seems to be able to conduct himself very well at school and with others and is very well liked by his teachers.
My son attended public school through high school. Now that he is in college is where the trouble has really started to manifest. I’m not sure if we would have made another choice if he had been diagnosed at a younger age. He managed to get by ok. In grade school he seemed much more open to peer relationships, that all ended by high school though and he seemed more to himself. While he seemed to be liked by his peers, he just didn’t participate in social activities.
At 37 I have lived with misdiagnosed NVLDs and ADD for all of my life. Looking back ,I would not change a thing. Not the stress that comes with crossing oneself before writing a check,or being socially impervious to just what my role in a conversation is, much less a relationship.
That said, I managed to graduate from college; and while it is true that picking husbands was not one of my strengths, raising children definitely is.
I have been able to parent them with an empathy and compassion I was never shown. It is embarrassing to be impotent in the face of a second grade math problem, but you laugh, you learn, and you press on.
I noticed if I am ok, then my girls think they are too.One is off the charts gifted, and the other two are following in my shoes. But we focus on what we can solve today They love that. They accomplished a tangible task when the day is done. One they will need when they leave home, like dishwashing.
After all- don’t Steve Jobs and Bill Gates have Asperger’s or is that Gateway Cow just slinging mud in the spirit of politics?
Hang in, fight the good fight,
MJB
I have an 11 y/o daughter just diagnosed. All the info that I can find is about very young children. My child can dress herself and tie her shoes by herself. Any info on pre-teens through adulthood?
my son will be turning 11 in march. i have had nothing but bad luck trying to find help for him and am at quite a loss as to what to do next.he has great difficulty in school both socially and educationally but he has made improvments. i can not seem to find any therapists in my area. we live in waterloo quebec very small town but i can’t believe my son must suffer for that. if anyone knows where i can turn to for help i would very much appreciate it. brenda
Brenda: You might check to see if there is a branch one of the large LD support organizations in Quebec, there must be something. My guess is through one of these large organizations you’ll find a therapist.
thanks richard
does anyone have ideas on disipline for non verbal. whenever jacob(my son) does something that should be disiplined i can always bring it back to the fact that he has this learning disorder how can you disipline when he really can’t do it the way most other kids would. we are always in a stallmate when it comes to disipline. if there is a book or someone’s personal input i’d be happy to hear about it. brenda
You say ‘disipline the way most other kids would’
I dont think there is a one such way is there, i’d say that disipline is as individual as the child or the issue that needs disipline for.
i understand that each child is different and so should the disipline but with jacob he can be told to do or not to do the same thing 10 times where as his step sister and brothers you would need to twll them only once and the chore or task would be completed if not then the consequences would have to be paid.jacob just can’t seem to funtion the same way and that is where the problem comes in i am forever giving him more chances to complete said task where as the other kids are expected to complete it only the first time. it is very trying for me to know when to treat him the same or to treat him differently due to his learning disorder. that was what i was trying to say. brenda
My son is 20, in college and I’m just beginning to realize the problem may well be NVLD. With that said are there any good stories about adult employment?? And how did they/you help make that happen? Do these kids (practically adult and trying to figure out career)ever figure out how to have real friends and not just acquaintances? Lonely, I think…
Cindy,
I posted a couple entries January 30th regarding my sons college experience and I’m interested in knowing how your son is doing in college. I have a 24 year old son who is having a difficult time. While he’s not giving up, it’s taking a long time. He says he is not lonely, but I’m not sure if I believe him. Please read my entries and contact me if you have any info or if I can supply you with info.
Joan
Academically he is doing OK in college. Thats a pretty big deal in in itself, as I was not at all sure he could do it. He tells me, and I think it is true, “College is way harder than high school. I have to really work.” He very much wants to succeed, but at times doesn’t get the timing down on doing his work and studying ahead. Then he gets very stressed, but says he can only work when the pressure is on…can’t get himself to focus otherwise.
FYI, he is at a small college in Ct. called Mitchell college. It has an extensive LD support program which is an additional cost after tuition , board etc. I think it is a good school for him.
He has always been very independent and resistant to help. That has made this all that much more difficult. I’m proud of the fact that he seems to be making it in school, but again I worry more about his lack of friends and tendency to be alone when I know he would like to be included. He is well liked but seldom included it seems. But actually how would I know. He tells us as little as is humanly possible!
The career thing is big. I think maybe teaching in some capacity. He works well with kids and likes it. I don’t know, I don’t know… I wish someone had some answerers for any of us. I do know it is not healthy to live my life around him. (Hard!) He is going to have to make his own way. I just want to guide him with as much knowledge as possible.
Cindy,
Your son sounds so much like my son. The only advantage I have is that my son lives at home. So, I can see what he’s doing as far as social stuff. Which is a big zero with peers. He seems to do better with older or younger people, so he does do things, just not with people his own age.
At least your son is at a college that has a program to deal with this. That’s where we made our big mistake. My son had been at a community college and was in the process of transfering to a private college when the diagnosis was made. There was no mention of schools that are equiped to deal with this type of LD. He struggled academically for a year and a half and had to withdraw in January. We are now searching for a school that deals with LD’s that he can commute to. At least there are 3 or 4 to pick from.
My son is majoring in elementary ed. He loves working with kids. But, my husband and I have heard this could be difficult when it comes time to find a job. There is a possibility that he won’t be able to pass the certification testing. Even if he does, he still might not be able to get a teaching job, due to his transcripts, they won’t look to good! At least your boy is doing better academically, so he might have a better chance.
I by no means want to discourage his choice, but I also don’t want him to put all the time and money into something that will have been a mistake.
The president at the college he just left was trying to encourge him to major in and area that will focus on his strength’s, English or Journalism. But, he still wants to pursue teaching. The person who did the LD testing also doesn’t feel this will have a good outcome. But, I’m not going to be the one to tell him he can’t do it. Who know’s, maybe he can!
Where can we get help for Non-Verbal Learning Disabilitys. If anyone can tell me where we can get help and support for dealing with this challenge. I would really greatly appreciate that.
There are a lot of good character traits that go along with NLD and a lot of misconceptions as well. Not ever having been what is considered normal I don’t know the what the difference but I know that it is huge. Mine is inherited from my dad who has always been considered very eccentric. I am a special ed teacher and I do have a gift with my students because I can accept for who they are. My son is 14 and it was severe trouble at school that led me to this diagnosis. I am glad I found others like us.
I just discovered this site and want to express my appreciation for everyone who shared their stories, as well as for the site itself. I am a speech language pathologist in Maine. A neuropsychologist and I facilitate a group for adults with NVLD in Yarmouth. We are always gathering new resources to share with our group. We meet weekly to discuss strategies for school, work and social situations, problem solve relationship issues, and brainstorm options. At present we have an all-male group (except for the facilitators;our biggest challenge to date has been locating women who have NVLD to provide a balanced picture – I’m delighted to have this site to share with our members.
Thanks so much!
Leslie
Thank you Leslie. Are we talking Yarmouth, MA? Would you like me to do a post on your group? Email me the details if yes. rwanderman at gmail dot com.
i’m 18 years old, and after having read the first couple entries on this page, it seems as if people with non-verbal learning disorders lead painful and awkward lives.
i have a mild case of this disorder, so i might not be quite so affected, but reading this page was still pretty disappointing.
are there any success stories, at least in terms of social interaction?
luckily i don’t have any of the motor impairment that is typical of NVLD, and i can read people’s faces relatively easily, so do you think that there is hope? is social interaction for me, something that can be learned?
it’s not like i’m a complete social failure; i’m well liked, but people are often confused when i don’t talk more, or when i’m not interested in hanging out. for me, it’s a matter of “breaking out of my shell” and being less scared in social situations. i guess you could say that i still have at least some optimism for the future.
anyway, sorry for using this space as my own little thoughts-area, haha, but i’d like to hear your guys’ opinions on my situation. i want to be successful in college, etc…………..
My 6 year old son has been diagnosed with NVLD but his social skills are fine. He recignises facial expression and tone of voice no worries. He was refered to the guidence councilor who diagnosed him because ho simply won’t learn to read or write. He will be seven this year and he still can not write his own name. He’s in a very small school and gets heaps of 1 on 1 time but is not advancing. He only recignises a handful of letters and a few numbers. e is easily distracted by anything and won’t sit still on his chair for 5 minutes. I’m considering pulling him out of conventional schooling and enrolling him in a steiner school. Does any one know of this mothod of schooling? He has an extraudinary memory and is very inteligent but will only learn about what he’s interested in at the time. I don’t know if a steiner school is the best thing to do but he’s starting to notice that he’s far behind the other kids as far as writing and math goes. I don’t want him to hate school because he thinks he’s dumb. Is this the righ thing to do? does anyone know of someone in a similar situation?
Hi,
I have a son who is 11. He was diagnosed with a non-verbal learning disorder almost 2 years ago. Parenting this child has been the hardest thing I have ever experienced, and it remains a real challenge in our lives. I love him with all my heart, and he is a sensitive and funny boy who would love nothing more than to play with kids all day long. Unfortunately for him, the NLD has been devastating for him socially — he is seen almost universally by peers (and often by teachers) as being either annoying or a total jerk (or sometimes both). Since he has a very difficult time “reading” people, he’ll often do things that are annoying but doesn’t realize that people are getting fed up with him. And because he has a very tough time remembering that anyone around him has their own experiences and feelings, he says whatever he wants whenever he wants (NO editing) and often hurts people’s feelings and pisses people off. Impulse control is not his strong point, and if he’s mad at me he’ll shout, “I hate you! You’re the suckiest mom! You never do ANYTHING for me! I want to live in another home,” and I have to try and remember (as my heart clenches with hurt, or I see red with anger at how unfair such a statement is, since I/we do so much for him) that he can’t control himself in that moment. He has worked with a therapist for years, is on an anti-depressant because his self esteem was so, so low at the time of his diagnosis and is now (thank god) in a private school (for kids with learning disabilities) that is working with him and supporting him in the way he has needed support for a long time. He wrestles with a lot of self-loathing and sadness, but the diagnosis was a relief because now we know what we are dealing with. We know we will keep him in specialized private schools through high school, even though they’re really expensive, because the help he gets may be the difference between a productive adult life and a very challenging, sad adult life. We have found role-playing helps a lot (“when you say that to me, look how I react. Look at my face. It is happy or sad?”) and trying to always point out the good things he does (“wow, thanks for apologizing for your behavior. That was very thoughtful.”) I have seen some big shifts over time and he is becoming more aware of the feelings of others, which is a huge step. Before, it seemed he had no compassion for anyone. I adore this kid and I believe that with lots of support and love that he will move into a life that will be fulfilling for him. Good luck to all of you struggling with this very difficult challenge.
After, reading Trixi’s post I was moved to tears. If I had any doubts about the concept of universality, I don’t any longer. I am living and breathing the life you describe, my son been diagnosed with NVLD and it is increasingly difficult to find play experiences for him. He is not athletic so he doesn’t have that into the social world of boys his age and as he gets older, his social circle gets smaller. I so wish that there was a community a group of parents like us who could meet and get our kids together where the “quirks” wouldn’t matter. I have taken him to therapeutic play groups but I want something that feels more natural.
Additionally, I had my son in Waldolf school (steiner), it was a terrible experience for us. Because he had fine motor coordination problems, he never cam near meeting their expectations and if social issues or implusivity are issues then I would reconsider. Yes they delay reading and writing but the focus is on social and total conformity (conversion) to the steiner principles. When my kid questioned the belief in fire fairy they thought he was subversive. It is a culture unto it’s self. Investigate, before getting in to those waters.
Best of luck to us all.
I have a 14yrs old gifted, NVLD boy who is exact description of Trixi’s son. I have gone thru almost all the treatment
and test there is in current world and he has gone thru 8 different schools including public, private, and boarding school. ( He just came back from a boarding school that just ended it’s school year.) I would love to find out more about NVLD boarding schools that caters kids with academicaly able but missing social cues. Thank you
Hi, I am a teenager who was diagnosed with NVLD when I was about 12. I didn’t really understand what that meant, but looking back on my early teen years I can tell I really fit the bill. I was an avid reader, and would avoid awkward social situations by staying in my room and reading. I remember feeling so alone during those years, I knew I acted strangely and had no idea how to correct my behavior.
As I got older I was able to form a group of friends and slowly acclimate myself to social situations until I was only a little bit odd, rather than that bizarre kid nobody wanted to be around. Now I am on my way to work in the fields Science and Computer Programming, something I never thought I would be able to do when I was younger.
The way I coped with living with NVLD was not to think about what I couldn’t do, but how this gifted me. I have always been extremely well spoken and have an amazing memory. It is these very specific strengths which have allowed me to flourish. People with NVLD can live their lives as well as anybody else, and in some ways I think we are all a bit more interesting for it.
Wow Avery, that’s amazing.
Which steps did you take towards being able to work in computer science and programming?
I suspect that I have undiagnosed NLV. I have a PIQ/VIQ gap of 40 points and match many of the symptoms of NLV.
Anyway, I too would like to work in a field which requires complex math (finance or international business), but I’ve been so weary of math since high school.
I failed algebra and geometry in high school, some of which I’d blame my own laziness, but the rest I would blame my natural inability to grasp math as easily as others, but now I’m willing to work hard in college so that I can major in the fields I really want to major in.
Do you have any advice I should take Avery in achieving my math comprehension goals?
Since my LD is also NV, and has to do with mathematics, especially with spatial issues, I’d like to send Sanford a response to his question as well. My clues about my own differences come from a neuropsychological standpoint, since I did a lot of reading in that area when I first ran into my own kind of people. I have balance and spatial orientation issues, always tipping over, bumping into walls, and driving into the concrete bumpers in parking lots. My vision doesn’t seem to be affected, since it’s pretty poor, but fully corrected. I’m also red-green colorblind, not sure where that fits in. I also have auditory processing deficits, often “hearing but not processing” conversations, requests, and oral directions.” I can’t remember names very well, never have, so I also seem to suffer from “anomia,” as well as chronic divergent thought patterns. This “circular or spiraling thought process” helps me dive in on facts I have trouble remembering, since I often remember the movie, the face, and co-actors names, but not the name I’m seeking. I’m verbally compensated, because I have to talk myself through to get to my point, and often have a strange and obscure viewpoint, simply because I seem to come into my thoughts and perceptions at what I fonndly call a “skew angle.” So, since my perceptions of social, information, and environmental cues are, to my mind, somewhat untrustworthy, I’ve often been hesitant in my self-expression. So, in my case, I think the answer to your question might be “complicated,” in that it arises from multiple sources. Did I mention that I am ambidextrous, and also have what they call mixed dominance: some tasks seem to trigger a switch in my “master eye.” So, try keeping that all straight. The computer keyboard seems to be an equalizer for me, so I keep one around, even find myself typing in my sleep. If this comment is too long, consider it another sign of my circular thought process…!
Wow!! I am so happy to hear that I am not alone. I have FINALLY been diagnosed with NVLD at the age of 42 years old. Of course, I have always thought I was a loser since I could not tell time on an analog clock until the fifth grade or that I could not give change. I still don’t understand fractions or measurements. I could not find my way out of wet paper bag, but nobody would ever know I have NVLD. It is my shame, and I always fear that I will be discovered! I have always felt like a failure, job issues that many have mentioned, etc. etc. Thanks for sharing your stories. Now my question has anybody gone to a learning specialist to work with this disability and did you achieve your goals?
Cheers!
Elizabeth
My child who will be a senior in high school now refuses any assistance with school. His grades have all dropped this year. He says school is not for him and he does not care when I have said the grades are not acceptable. He refuses to go to counseling and he refuses to acknowledge his LD’s. He is disruptive and disrespectful at home when he does not get his way or when conversation arise with school. Nothing is working to decrease his inappropriate behavior. Does one just “jump ship” at this point, “fine do it your way”? Nothing I do will get him to invest in his education and it is the major area of conflict. He has a diagnosis of NVLD but does well socially and with sports. Trouble is 30plus difference in language and performance scores so they gave the diagnosis of NVLD but I question if this is accurate since he does not meet all the criteria. Any advice is welcomed.
I just read everyone else’s posts about coming to terms with having a NVLD. At 50 I have just gotten diagnosed officially. I completed a neuropsychological evaluation a few weeks ago and met with the doctor to go over it. I went through the process before eight years ago and it was anything but positive. I did it in a university setting which was cheaper, but the way the conference was handled left me feeling horrible about myself.
I came to the realization that something was wrong with me in 2000. I was working at a healthcare finance organization, and although they liked me, and paid me okay (actually very generously) I knew that I could not perform anywhere near the level that I should be able to perform. I had passed the CPA exam a few years earlier. It kept me at a much lower level. Unfortunately the healthcare finance org went out of business in 2001. We lost our loan portfolio and could not get new funding or equity. I went back to school in my 30′s. After losing a few jobs in public accounting I realized those billable hours was probably not good for me. I could not work fast enough and I was different than everyone else I worked with.
At first I thought that it was ADHD. I started taking Ritalin in 1998 and have been on some form of medication since then (with the exception of 15 months). The medication allowed me to focus and concentrate for the first time in a really long time. I was also at that point very well aware of my differences and gaps.
As far as socializing goes I do have friends and people like me. I am divorced and with my inconsistent job stability it makes it hard to have the money to do things and hang out with my friends. None of my friends have NVLD and all of them do well and live well. I also get sick of being asked what I am going to do next and why I cannot work as a CPA. Very few people seem to understand what a NVLD is.
I know that my NVLD is genetic, I could swear that my mom definitely had it and my dad had some learning issues as well (but they didn’t have the same ones) as a result my brother does not have any issues with motor skills or visual spatial, visual perception etc, and doesn’t have much understanding about how it affects me. I walked late and that was blamed on me having flat feet, my brother who is 3.5 years younger walked at about 1 year. I read, wrote, and did math on schedule and was in the gifted class until age 13. I was taken out of the program in junior high school. School got rough in high school but I was in some honors classes which kept my grades higher since most honors teachers don’t give out low grades. A bad grade was an 88. College I barely made it through when I was younger. I went back later and did well.
Without stimulant medication I would not focus at all. My eyes cannot focus on their own. I would be staring into space all day and driving would not be safe. The medication however is not a high enough level for me to automate so that I won’t talk myself through everything that I do. I can’t go to a higher level for other reasons unfortunately. I tried. Talking myself through everything that I do is not only annoying, it also takes away from the mental aspect of what I am doing since all of my mental attention goes to the physical aspect of it, even at something like cashiering or hanging dresses and slows me down.
I did tax returns this year with H & R Block. I got through the coursework okay but since my motor skills are really bad and I had to talk my way through stuff the returns took a long time, even the easy ones. The harder ones got me flustered and I often asked for help. The people liked me in my office and did help me. I had been the client service coordinator in that office the year before, which was okay but not very challenging mentally so I chose to be a preparer. They were also willing to help me because I am an excellent team player and would do things to help them in whatever way I could.
I also had done sensory integration therapy with an occupational therapist for almost 2 years (2000 – 2002). I found out a few weeks ago that when I employ some of the techniques and methods I learned in SI therapy, that it is easier to get things done. My eyes focus better and I am able to do things without talking out loud and therefore am free to concentrate on the mental aspect of whatever I am doing. It makes me feel much better about things.
Medication also helped me socially and at work because I noticed the nonverbal stuff regarding communication much more and wouldn’t interrupt people if they were doing something else unless it was urgent, and although it does make me quieter than I am naturally it makes me far more articulate and aware of what appropriate conversation is and what is not. It also helps socially in terms of not choosing to focus on relationships that make no sense and where there is no interest. I also know to look at people’s faces and not just react to language. My father used to tease me and my mother when I was younger only I was never aware of it until after I was on medication. My mom passed away a few years ago and my dad has dementia now, but when she was alive he used to say some things that were not mean and not directed at her and she would just react to them without ever looking at his face. He used to have this huge grin on his face or a smirk, but he always got a rise out of her. I know that I am not always able to express my reactions to stuff well in terms of facial expression cause my facial expression doesn’t always show that I know someone is kidding and the medication tends to make me serious but I can change expressions and laugh and smile on stimulant meds. People told me on strattera I could not.
Now I have to figure out where to go from here and how to get back into full time work doing something that I enjoy and will be a good fit for me. I have worked since the healthcare finance org but never with the true self knowledge and acceptance of my situation. Now I know that I need to if I want to lead a full life and be able to handle all the aspects of my life, mental, social, emotional, financial and feel good about myself and what I can do and what will work well in other areas as well.
I am interested in hearing more about what others are doing as far as work goes who are able to work successfully. I am especially interested in knowing what you have chosen for jobs, whether you have disclosed to your employers and how you went about doing it. I am also interested in hearing about strategies you use while you work.
I just discovered this site, and reading all the entries find myself with a mix of emotions. My son, now 12, was diagnosed with NVLD at 6; he’s described as “twice exceptional” with gifted verbal scores and average performance scores, but a 30 + point discrepancy, so some of his issues are severe, while he can often “compensate” with quick wit, a flare for mimickery, and lots of useful information about games and films that some other kids find funny or interesting. Still, he’s often lonely and wonders why he can’t seem to fit in with others.
Since learning this diagnosis (we’d thought possibly Asperger’s or ADD, but NVLD fits the closest), we’ve been able to adjust most days. However, Mary and Trixi’s posts could have been written by me. I’ve gone from despair to guilt to qualified hope, and dream he may yet have an amazing life if we can survive the teen years.
He received some support from his public school, esp. with learning to be more aware of pragmatic social cues, making eye contact, and so on. But he has increasingly withdrawn beneath his IPOD and games or books, despite being thrilled if anyone calls him to hang out. He never makes that gesture. And inevitably, after being with a boy or two for an afternoon there’s some story of injustice or anger–he’s so literal-minded that he just doesn’t get the increasingly subtle teasing and overreacts (sometimes seeming rude or over-the-top loud or whatever in response). Summers are typically exhausting for us because he responds so much better to structure.
This past year I sought help to learn what my own issues might be–I’d guessed ADD, depression, anxiety, or some combination. After a thorough battery of tests and several sessions of counseling, the psychologist suggests NVLD. I hadn’t shared my son’s diagnosis, and while at first I was shocked, reviewing my life in light of the NVLD profile I can see how there were problems all along–ones I too “compensated” for by using a sharp memory, humor, and a determination to pursue goals even if it took me longer than others.
To answer some of you who wonder about yours or your child’s future, I can say that while mine was never an easy life I was able to find a subject that I loved–English–and held on despite setbacks to complete my PhD at age 34. I first taught at a competitive research university but could never seem to focus enough to complete a book, required for tenure, and didn’t collaborate smoothly enough with others to seek their mentoring. I didn’t argue with anyone, I just tried to work out things on my own.
I had also had ups and downs with relationships–able to initiate them but rarely to sustain closeness beyond a year or two. I was engaged four times, finally marrying at age 39 (to a saint, I should add). However, I’ve been fortunate in attaining tenure at a smaller college and continuing to love my work, despite hurdles you might expect from the NVLD list of symptoms. I have 3-4 friends and have been able, again, to compensate the “quirks” with trying hard to be kind and accepting to peers and students alike.
My question for others stems from a fear I can’t seem to confront: what if this question of normalcy is off the mark? What if we’re all hobbled and helped by brains wired differently? To be sure, NVLD seems to present a load of challenges, and it saddens me that there’s no drug to ingest that can relieve the isolation or missteps.
But some days I’m just overwhelmed by the emotions of thinking my son is “outcast” and that there’s more I could do if I weren’t so different myself.
Would love to hear from others,
Jen
Jen: “What if we’re all hobbled and helped by brains wired differently?”
We are. We’re hobbled when we don’t fit in or can’t read situations, we’re helped when thinking differently is a useful attribute and we’re not judged harshly for doing it.
Part of life is getting comfortable with who we are, the particular wiring of our brains, even if it’s not quite like everyone else’s. Of course, when one is acutely self-conscious it seems like these differences are a bit more than they might actually be.
The drug issue is a mixed bag (if there were a drug): what we don’t want is a completely homogenous society where everyone thinks and acts the same way. This is easy to say, a lot harder to live when you’re the oddball people look at judgmentally. Still, getting comfortable with one’s self can make being an oddball tolerable, even fun at at times.
Thanks, Richard. I can accept your point intellectually, but emotionally it’s difficult to observe a boy’s rejection, see that he isn’t in sync with his peers, and so is hurting. At the same time, I agree with you that fitting in –especially in the competitive, sports-obsessed, conservative and rather cruel community we find ourselves in–would be a mixed bag at best.
But some days I wish it were easier to go through the hours without yearning for connection and a sense of our place in the world. That can be elusive and painful, even if it makes for sharp critique of what’s shallow in our culture, and acute observation at a remove. Maybe that’s what it is to be a thinking person.
I wonder if there are many more adults than the medical community has evaluated who have NVLD traits and were perhaps misdiagnosed with ADD. I know my college is seeing a considerable uptick in students with Asperger’s (how many of these, too, are more properly evaluated as NVLD?). The toughest issue I face as a professor is trying to help them grasp metaphor and other subtle interpretive meanings. I have no idea why I was able to pick up on these elements of reading/writing. Perhaps it was memorization and repetition early on, and I re-wired through the white matter? (Neuroscientists’ eye-rolling here.) Who knows?
I found Richard Powers’ National Book Award winning novel THE ECHO MAKER (2006) a stunning reflection on the mind-brain phenomenon (we are all hard-wired with quirks and missfires and gaps). It’s also a poignant and moving evocation of all the ways we fail to recognize and fulfill one another. I recommend it for all of us struggling to make sense of being human, with or without NVLD.
Jen: “we are all hard-wired with quirks and missfires and gaps”
Wow, you keep on rollin’ ‘em out… great thinking and writing.
We’re all weird in some context other than one we’re comfortable in. So, when we find a comfortable place, we tend to stay there or certainly return to that place to keep our equilibrium. Maybe the issue is finding that place to begin with. Again, I didn’t find that place myself until I was quite grown up so maybe it’s a bit much to expect a young person to accumulate enough experience to find it. In time… and yes, it’s hard to watch the misfires and reactions along the way, for sure.
I read both of your comments regarding drugs. In my case if I hadn’t gone the route of taking stimulants at age 40, I probably would never have gotten as far as I had. My eyes would have been completely out of focus all the time, I would not have learned much and although I had passed the CPA exam without ever taking medication because I didn’t know about ADHD and didn’t think to look into it.
If I hadn’t taken medication I would not have been so aware of my differences that I could articulate them to a therapist. I would never have been aware of the gap in my hand eye coordination specifically. I would never have been able to make eye contact with others, and I wouldn’t have become aware of “now.” I would never have learned what was worth focusing on and what was not, as well as being aware of which relationships specifically with the opposite sex were nothing more than a friendship. My friends would try and tell me but before the medication I would not have listened, and found something else worth focusing on, I would not have been able to go inward to derive satisfaction in life.
I also was not all that aware of what was just plain inappropriate topics of conversation, took everything that was said literally, without looking at people’s facial expressions. My physical coordination is better with medication and I am safer on a physical level, I am also a safer driver.
There were two people I worked with on a job for about fifteen months that were in my department one who I was convinced either was high functioning autistic, savant like in his ability to remember item numbers in the purchasing department. There were lots of numbers. Socially he was awkward, and definitely had issues with understanding money. He made okay money but would keep on fixing his car over and over again. The car was about 14 years old and had 300,000 miles on it and he liked to drive it to Atlantic City on weekends. We would keep telling him that he was going to get stuck on the road.
The other woman I thought possibly had ADHD, but it could have been non-verbal learning disability. She would run into our managers office and interrupt him just to tell him stuff that had absolutely nothing to do with the job. It was usually just personal stuff. He was a nice guy and I got along well with him. He used to tell me that he felt like he had people who acted like they were in kindergarden only they were 50 and 60 year olds. I got along well with managers and coworkers because I was able to be conscious of taking up people’s time and was good with keeping confidences so people would tell me things. The drugs helped me to think before acting.
Should we be carbon copies of one another? No definitely not. I’m not looking to be. I never was. I know that there are things that medication can never do for me no matter how high a level of medication I take. I strongly doubt that my neurologist will force me to stop taking the medication even after reading the evaluation from the neuropsychologist because some of my issues would be much worse.
We all have different deficits and strengths that are part of us and we each know what is right to do. Socially I am more comfortable, and physically I am safer on medication. My wit and sense of humor are better without it and I am more outgoing but I wouldn’t be able to focus my eyes or control my body. I would never stay awake in movies.
Hope: I hear you and I have no doubt that had medication been around when I was younger I’d have used it and hopefully, like you, had enough self-awareness so that I could use it sparingly but to help me get what I wanted out of life.
My wife says it’s too late for me, old dogs, new tricks and thankfully I’m old enough so the days of my needing to bear down on work and career are over. To be honest, I’ve always been lucky enough to have fallen into mini-careers that made me happy (and money) so maybe I wouldn’t have opted for medication even if it had been around. Don’t know. Thanks for your great comment Hope. It would be great if you’d consider a biographical essay for this site. Nothing to get worked up over, just a way to expand what you’ve written here. Let me know if you’re interested: rwanderman at gmail.com
I am a mother of an 18yr old boy who has had a number of therapists and professionals work with him over the last 3 years that were not professionals in NLD. Last fall I came to the realization that these people were not focusing on the cause but the symptoms. I found a specialist and the difference is incredible! It is as if we were going to a cardiologist for a dermatology problem! My issue now it that he is going off to college in DC in 6 weeks and I desperately need to find a NLD specialist in the DC area. If anyone has any information on someone specializing in NLD there please let me know.
Ellen,
What kind of specialist did your son go to? How long did your son work with them? What type of issues does your son have with his NVLD?
I am an adult with NVLD. Read my posts regarding my issues. They didn’t do much regarding that stuff when I was a kid, but even if they did, I doubt that my parents would have recognized my issues if doctors or the school didn’t since they were challenged themselves with LD issues. I won’t take up space with specifics unless people ask me about them.
I would go to a learning specialist now but I know that my insurance would not cover it. It would be nice if it was covered but I really can’t complain they are good with all my medical stuff, and they definitely do not make money on insuring me and haven’t since I was on the plan. I paid privately for the testing but in the long run I think it will be worth it.
Hope
I hope someone can help me. My 24 year old son has been diagnoed with ADD, specific Learning disablities in language processing and also a severe math disabilty. He can not make change, tell time, or problem solve., yet he has mechanical abilty. He has anxiety and poor manners and social skills. He never calls anyone for fear of rejection. It is heartbreaking as the longer he is alone the worse his situation becomes.We so desperately want him to be successful at a job but so far he has lost all jobs he ever tried. I am looking for any suggestions of jobs for people with major math disabilities. Please offer any advice.
To Terri Sibel and Natalie who posted following my post last May 15, 2007,
One year later since I last posted. I have a daughter who just finished her freshman year at a private college in NY state. This is 7 hrs from our home in the midwest. The first semster was pretty horrible. Her time management skills are non existent. She is pre dental major but couldn’t keep up with the pace with the pre med bio class. Once she dropped it things went fine. The second semester she took slighlty easier classes but still within her Health Science major. Her strenghts are Math and Science as long as a lot of critical thinking is not involved. Writing and reading comprehension are very difficult for her. Socially, I think the year was OK. Unfortuanely the kids she liked most have chosen to transfer to other schools so she will head back to school this sept with out her best pals. I am not sure if she made any other friends and will have a single this year. She will be in a mixed fresh/soph dorm so hopefully she will make new friends. She gets extended time in college which makes the difference between doing well and failing. Without extended time I think she couldn;t pass. She processes soooo slowly and is a perfectionist. I doubt being a dentist is a good career choice for her but don’t want to burst her bubble. I think she would be better suited for another career in the health care field. She doen’t handle stress well either. She has difficulty seeing when people are taking advantage of her as with her summer job this year. She is so responsible she is afraid to quit even though she is being taken advantage of . As her mother this is so frustrating. Terri and Natalie from last year. You didn’t list your email so I would know how contact you. If still interested let me know.
I will be happy to facilitate all of you getting in touch with one another without you posting your emails publicly here. But, I need you to email me at rwanderman @ gmail dot com giving me your email and a thumbs up.
MY STORY
Hello,
I have to say I am quite perplexed from reading all these replies! I’m 23 years old (female) and find such great discrepancies between the abilities & deficits listed here, I’m not even sure I have NVLD anymore! However, we do share certain similarities. I’m posing with the hope of receiving some feedback and hopefully to give some inspiration to the people who posted here, and may be looking for hope.
I recently graduated from the top university in Canada and will be applying to law schools next year and masters of political science programs in the country. I did not find my disability to impact my “abstract thinking” skills at all, unless they concerned spatial skills (my economics class, for instance, was the worst in university because of all the graphs…same with science/geography in high school) but I excelled in the arts and literature. I graduated an enhanced “gifted” type of program in high school, winning awards in Philosophy and Literature and was offered scholarships to the University of Toronto, and many other good schools. I’m surprised to hear that people here have had difficulty in school because I thought that this disability was mainly confined to spatial or motor skills, rather than conceptual thinking in general. Granted, it has taken me longer to finish assignments & I question whether this was due to my disability or mere perfectionism – I’ve had professors criticize me when I ask for extra time for essays because they claimed I was using my disability as an excuse when it wasn’t legitimate. However, I WAS diagnosed twice with a disability – once in grade 2 when I had extreme difficulty learning to tell time, count change, and was very socially awkward. I kept to myself. However, despite this fact, I was writing very good abstract poetry at age 11…winning poetry awards, etc. So whereas “nonverbal” subjects were definitely not my strength (I couldn’t tie my shoes until much later in life; couldn’t put on a pinny in gym, was extremely uncoordinated, etc.) I had strengths in the “verbal” areas. To this day, I still question. I did reduce my course load in university because I found it difficult with the pressure and I had to work extremely hard to do well….but at the same time, I’m not sure if it was moreso due to bad time management skills, laziness and/or perfectionism (I was also diagnosed by a psychologist with OCD and perfectionist traits.. so I think this combination made undergrad difficult.)
I also find my social skills have improved quite a bit since elementary school. In the earlier grades I was very socially awkward but also overweight which made me the ‘awkward kid out.’ I had little to no friends; stuck to myself & felt like everyone was against me. I never had any real relationships with the opposite sex. I also noticed that I developed friendships with people much older easier than peers. However, in high school I actually lost a lot of weight – joined a competitive swim team, etc. and started forming friendships although my self-esteem took a huge hit already. In university, after losing weight and styling my hair differently, I started to look good. I’ve always essentially been pretty but my high school nerdiness & weight issues kept me from seeing it. Soon enough people wanted to be my friend, I was able to attract men easier and was actually sought for commercial and print modelling. A HUGE turn around, so here’s some hope for others. However, up until only a few weeks ago, I have suffered from depression on/off, confidence issues, and perhaps social anxiety. I’m not sure… I have had difficulty finding people I could really “connect” with, and while men are attracted to me, I’m honestly not attracted to them. I’ve never really had a boyfriend but I’m not gay either. I was elected to political laedership positions in school and can ‘fake’ being social and impress people with my articulate skills and questions but when it comes to building and maintaining close friendships, I find it really hard. The current guy I’m dating just graduated Harvard with a degree in philosophy, however, and I find I can click well with people of high intelligence and sensitivity, but that’s hard to find. Due to my disability, I often question my own potential, however, and wonder whether I’m “really” smart or how. I could only manage a mall job for 2-3 weeks before quitting (in the shoe dept) because I find closing the cash too difficult & memorizing the names of all the shoes. That’s another BIG problem – my working/rote memory skills are very poor so I have to review a lot. This may or may not pose a problem in law school, so again… it will impact my career options. However, I often find I come up with good ideas and am known as the “idea” person in groups or business.
So in conclusion, I’ve found my disability to mainly impact my spatial/motor coordination skills, working/rote memory and perhaps (?) to some extent social skills. I’m not exactly sure how it affects my social skills but I do know it’s hard for me to develop relationships and I’m introvertive – I’m not sure if it’s because of my disability or personality, or what – perhaps a combination. I’d be interested in hearing from others… my skills and liabilities seem to reflect the characteristics of this disorder to some extent but at the same time, there are divergences. Apparently people with NVLD have very good verbal skills (I’m a good writer and articulate…) and spelling/writing is not a problem for me. I was surprised to read that some people did find this to be a problem. However, it took me 3 years to learn to drive a car and even now I’m only partly licensed (have my G2, at 23, but will be going for my G soon enough.) It has impacted me in more of the ‘day to day’ activities, I suppose, and I do find multitasking difficult and concentrating for extended periods of time, but at the same time I’m very hardworking and determined to succeed. I will not let my disability interfere with my professional and personal goals & I hope that the people on this site will not either.
I appreciate whoever may read and respond to this message and wish you the best of luck as well.
Regards…
p.s. after reading another site which details how people with NVLD prefer “concrete language’ rather than abstract, I’ve concluded that I only have some characteristics of NVLD but certainly not others. I love abstract thinking and almost prefer it to concrete. If anyone is familiar with the Myers-Briggs personality test (which I would recommend you look into, just out of interest) I am an INTP. That is the MOST abstract or one of the most abstract personality profiles out of the 20+ varieties.
That said, I have had 2 tests administered by psychologists at my school (once in grade 2 and once in my 3rd year of university) which confirmed I had a disability (NVLD.) So I don’t doubt that it exists, and certainly I do share some characteristics. But that said, I am definitely NOT a perfect profile of a person with NVLD and I think people shouldn’t just blindly accept this disorder without questioning HOW it affects them. It may very well be that you have talents you’re dismissing because of what some website supposedly says about you.
I don’t think I would have won poetry, philosophy, and literature awards of achievement & scholarships to top universities if I had “extreme difficulties with abstract thinking skills.” So people double check your information and think for YOURSELF how this affects you. It can really be quite empowering to do so.
Hello,
It is very impressing to hear everyone’s stories and willingness to help themselves.
I have a situation maybe someone can give me some help/feedback/advise?
My husband has shared with me about his LD – but for many years, knew there is something more to the story that he was not telling me. There are many similarities between him and some of the stories here. He shares qualities of nvld but insist that it was just a math problem that the pschologist told him he had. Because he seem to be a target when he was young, he was abused by the same gender – the behaviorism of back then kinda still lingers now. Obsivoulsy this is very hard to try and explain to him – to help him that certain things he does – well, it doesn’t look right.
I love him so much with all my heart – Because of new discoveries from his past, I don’t know how to help him nor us.
I am amazed on how Robert came to terms with what he had. This was the discussion with my husband – he needs to accept himself and love himself but he doesn’t accept his disability.
Would anyone have any advice from their experience on how I could help him. I know this is something that takes time.
Much appreciated – Thank you so much
Sincerely,
perplexed wife
Hello all,
I am interested to see if I will have any comments/suggestions on this posting. My name is Lisa. I live in the U.S. and a recent college graduate. I have just been doing some reading online, and it sounds to me that I have nvld. 4 years ago, I had a neuropsychological evaluation and was told that I do have very weak visual spatial abilities, but high verbal skills. He did not give a specific diagnosis.
I have always been able to excel in school, but I do need to spend a lot of time on my studies. I seem to mostly have my visual spatial reasoning affected. I have a poor sense of direction. Finding my way around when driving is a huge problem for me. I get confused very easily if I’m in an unfamiliar place, and I sometimes also get lost when driving in my hometown because I don’t have a visual image of the location from where I am. Though I am fortunate that I have been able to make and keep friends, I think I can use suggestions on recognizing social cues as well.
Thank you, and I look forward to any suggestions!
I was diagnosed with f&cking NLD, and maybe I’m just in denial about it, but I don’t fit all the symptoms. I had problems fitting at school, but that was more due to fear and anxiety that stayed with me in elementary school. Before moving, I had little in the way of problems integrating. Being one of the few Indian kids at my school when moving didn’t help, and that anxiety stayed with me. I recently graduated from UFT after having problems. The problems I had were more to do with bad choices and not making the right ones. Unfortunately, I graduated with only a 3 year B.A. and not the four year..which would give me greater job choices.
I graduated in women’s studies (which I hated) but excelled at without really ever showing up for class because it was primarily essay based. I’m currently doing Human Resources (which is where people who don’t like numbers go to) and I don’t like it either. I’ve been diagnosed with specific Non-verbal disorder from the mild to moderate range, and the pyschiastrist suggested that I be accomodated for future classes and such, which I’ve so far ignored, because in the real world, they can’t afford to accomodate you. It would hinder my chances of getting a job. I did have trouble fitting in at school in high school (but who didn’t).
Dear Anonymous in Canada,
I think you sound a lot like me in some respects. I found your story interesting and inspiring that you’re determined to not let your disability stop you in your career goals. I wish you the best as well.
I still am a little socially awkward, but I think I was much worse when I was younger. I did not start getting better at developing friendships until my college years. I know that I’m weak in some aspects of nonverbal communication, such as if someone is trying to tell me something using looks and gestures. I think that I’ve mostly been able to develop friendships because I have very slowly (though I’m still bad at it) learned to be more open in talking to friends, and that many people have told me I’m a very good listener. I know that last part is a personality characteristic, and I know I can consider myself fortunate. I’m sure that you might have some personality characteristics as well that people may genuinely admire about you.
To all who have a posting on this web page, thank you for your story. I am a single mom of a 13 year old boy, who is so awsome how ever he has some learning challanges (some very servire) as I do . we both feel so lost on what to do > I know that he can relate to the stories on this site and it gives me hope. The fact that other people work and think like my son is a good thing for me to see. You have all helped me to understand him better. thank you and Best wish s for your life. Keri
I am the mother of a college freshman who has dealt with most of the same situations discribed on this site since 3rd grade. Academically, with accommodations, he has been very successful but socially his life has been filled with unhappiness and lonliness. He was diagnosed severe LD at 7 but no one mentioned NVLD until his last testing for his accommodations in college. He has been on antidepressants for anxiety since 6th grade. His therapist disputed this diagnosis but his college life seems to be headed down the same road that he has been on forever. With all the complexity of college life accompanied by a demanding academic schedule (he is in engineering school) I feel he has hit a wall that he can’t get over. He has withdrawn from us and won’t even take our phone calls which a symptom of his extreme anxiety in this situation. I am so frightened for him and for the first time in his life he has not safety net or support group to keep him balanced. I think he should come home but I know the idea of this failure would be devesating for him emotionally. His low selfesteem has always been a problem and morphed into an obcession about his physical appearance. After reading these stories I suddenly don’t feel so alone in dealing with this. I know that sometimes my son feels “like a freak” and is so tired of stress and unhappiness of his life. He wanted to go to college and try and “feel normal”. He acknowledges that to get thru this he will need support but on thye other hand he wants to try and do it on his own. Any suggestions on how we intervene without making him feel inadequate in this task. This is the first time he is having trouble with school work. Thank you all for letting me rant. I would welcome all suggestions on ways for my son to get over this hump.
Mimi
Hi, I am a 22 year old college student with NVLD. I have had a HELL of a time so far. went to one university for 2 years, took random courses, had no direction only got about 40 credits after 2 years. Now i’m in my third year at Oregon State and i am an english major. Right now I am very frustrated. I do poorly on tests, work hard for C’s and I have to still take a math course and 6 terms of foriegn language to graduate. I fear this will not happen and I will become a loser in life. I fear the future, I do not know what I want to do for a job and I will not be happy just getting by. I feel hopeless right now
This is so devastating. Reading these posts reinforces a feeling of despair that I have harbored for so long. This is a painful reality, one that is very difficult to bear.
Marc,
I may have written to you at your e-mail address last year. I am answering your questiion here for the benefit of others.
I knew there was a problem in my life which needed fixing when I could not hold a job and my wife left me because she could not take it any more. She is gone but I have been employed since August of 2001.
Robert
JM,
You seem to be very depressed. Please get some professional help for your depression. You might start by seeing your primary care physician.
Robert
Brenda in Waterloo, Quebec,
Is Waterloo near Sherbrooke? If it is, the LDAQ probably has a branch in Sherbrooke. If Sherbrooke is too far, go to your local CLSC. They may be able to refer you to the appropriate professional.
Robert in Gatineau, Quebec
Kellie,
You say that the school guidance counsellor diagnosed your son. I used to be a school guidance counsellor. Guidance counsellors do nmot have the skills and knowledge to make this kind if diagnosis. You son needs either a psychoeducational assessment done by a school psychologist or a neuropsychological assessment done by a neuropsychologist.
Robert
Adam,
You sound depressed. Please see a counsellor at your university.
Robert
Hey all,
I know its been a while since people have posted on here, But I have a question(s)
I was diagnosed with a Non-Verbal Learning Disability (NLVD) when I was 17, and a Senior in high school.
For as long as I can remember before that, My mom, a single parent and I, struggled to find out what was wrong. I was taken to dozens of doctors over those 17+ years, including psychologists and nuerologists, and was often told I had ADD ADHD, and/or Bipolar disorder, which my grandmother has.
Then, we took a week-long trip to the Mayo Clinic up in Minnesota, and, after seeing a panel of several doctors, including neurologists, psychologists, psychiatrists, and even some behavioral therapy professionals. After reviewing my case, they all concluded I DID in fact have NLVD and NOT Bipolar, which I was afraid I did suffer from. I am relieved to know I do not have a mental disorder, only a disability that impairs how I take in, process, and regurgitate information, etc…
My questions are: Are any of you, or do u know anyone who is taking medication related to NLVD? I took lexapro until recently for anxiety, and Adderal off and on for ADHD.
Also, are there any certain diet restrictions/ideas that may help alleviate the anxiety, or foods that are good or should be avoided??!
Thanks for all the insight above, as well! (Thanks also to Robert)
I am a 24 year old with NVLD (diagnosed soph of college) and I am so lucky to have just graduated college this past May. I am going to let you know of the trials faced before receiving my diploma (B.A.), as well as after.
I always knew that I was different, had few friends to whom I could relate, and always loved to read. I was part of swim team, played sports, rode horseback (both Western and English) and loved to hike, even though coordination was difficult at times. In college, I realized something wasn’t right, took the initiative to get tested, and lo and behold I was a bit different than some of my friends (though most of my friends, I had found, were also living with an LD).
I took a job as a dishwasher at my school and excelled, now I realize that it’s probably because I wasn’t distracted by other people and they weren’t able to watch me work. I value privacy.
I moved to Florida for a great 4-year school primarily for students with LDs, excelled, and graduated top of my class (SACS accredited), and even gained entry to grad school.
Now the problem is: job security and stability. I have two jobs, one I was “let go” because I was different, they hired me back because they found they could use me in their product packaging area, but it’s a struggle because it’s too tempting to want to talk to people (excessively). I also have a job at a hotel where I run an evening food event, wishing I could shut off my motor mouth and just do the job. It’s hard to listen and be courteous when my mind is running all the time, but I manage as best as I can. I feel on edge most of the time, just wishing that I could be normal, without afflictions, and feel completely out of place. Working even 3 hr shifts at a time makes me extremely tired, because I often have to make up for what I lack socially.
I live in my own apartment, drive a car, and work, and juggle a relationship. I do need and require assistance from my family monetarily, and I’d like to get away from that sooner than later.
NVLD is a strange disorder, with twists and turns, but be strong and press on and I believe we will have a fighting chance. Do NOT be afraid to tell someone (employer, pref.) if you need help with something. Let them know HOW they can do it.
Good luck!
Hello,
I am the mother of a daughter w/NVLD who is about to graduate college this May. She has excelled academically, has had her ups and downs socially, but has really done much better the last two years and has formed significant lasting relationships. I have noticed that she has had difficulty in internships and jobs because of her disability (basically clerical and organizational.) She began college as an elementary education major and switched to gender studies doing very well in both. Does anyone have suggestions for career guidance? She has excellent verbal skills, is extremely empathetic and is great w/counseling, etc. She is interested in obtaining a MSW. Any suggestions or comments? Thanks you.
Dear Megan, Robert, and Adam. I have a 23 year old son with NVLD. There is so much I want to say to you. First of all, NVLD has a statistically significant correlation with comorbid conditions of depression, suicide, anxiety. Personally, I think this is because most of you a bright kids who don’t really get why it’s so hard to keep this together. So, the medication is not directly related to NVLD, but to the co-morbid conditions.
Having said that, let’s talk about college. My son went to art school and graduated with a degree in graphic design. He always liked computers. All of his courses, including the liberal arts, related to art in some way. So, he didn’t have to put together those big research papers that are so hard to get all the pieces together for. But…..he did have to do massive projects with hundreds of little pieces. I think that he was so motivated, at the same time always dealing with drugs and depression, that somehow he always pulled it together. So, for us, finding the right school and fit is important. Art students tend to be a little “fringy” anyway.
He is home now, and the transition has been really hard. He “learned” how to be in college. Now he is learning how to make friends at home. He is looking for a job, but doesn’t quite get how to make that happen yet. He does beautiful freelance work, so we know he is good at what he does. He is very disorganized, and a very sensitive person.
So, if you you want to talk to him write back to me and I will ask him to write to you. My website isn’t up yet, but will be in a few days.
Take care, Rhonda Page
My 6 year old daughter has just been diagnosed with perpetual reasoning and non verbal reasoning. She is presently failing all subjects at school and has trouble with friendships. It is breaking my heart to watch her suffer and not be able to help. I would greatly appreciate any information that anyone has to help. The school will not continue testing, and has decided to keep her in the 1st grade again next year. Keep in mind we are unable to use any private psychologist at this time as our financies are tight.
Hi Nicole,
My son is also 6 and has NLD and he is going to a private school for learning disabled kids-even though it is expensive, we get pretty good financial aid as we are very strapped financially. They work on social skills and academic issues. Early intervention is key and my mental health is much improved knowing that he is getting the help he needs. Good luck!
Does anyone have advice on whether it’s better for our quirky kids to be around kids with similar issues, or is it better for them to be around typical kids? Sometimes my son rises to the occasion around typical kids and other times it seems that it doesn’t matter since he misreads social cues.
Tasha,
I think both have their benefits, time and place. People are not their disability, but even still there’s something to be said and a comfort/acceptance to be gained when your in a peer group with similar challenges.
On the other hand, there’s some increasing evidence that in terms of social thinking progress, it’s better to be within a group that has some peers who are more skillful socially. Less “setting each other off” and more models to emulate.
I run social thinking groups for kids with these types of needs and I’d say both have their place.
DEAR JACKIE, NATALIE AND TERRI,
I ALSO HAVE AN 18 YEAR OLD DAUGHTER WHO HAS STRUGGLED WITH LEARNING ISSUES SINCE KINDERGARTEN. SHE WAS CLASSIFIED EARLY AND WENT TO A PRIVATE SCHOOL FOR CHILDREN WITH LD UNTIL SHE GRADUATED LAST JUNE 2008. SHE HAS BEEN TO MANY PROGRAMS – SPECIAL CAMPS – SPECIAL ACADEMIC SUMMER PROGRAMS ETC. SHE WAS ACCEPTED TO LANDMARK COLLEGE IN VERMONT AND A FEW OTHER COLLEGES WITH COMPREHENSIVE SUPPORT BUT WE FELT THAT EMOTIONALLY AND SOCIALLY SHE WAS NOT READY TO GO. SHE CURRENTLY ATTENDS OUR LOCAL COMMUNITY COLLEGE AND HAS BEEN RECENTLY DIAGNOSED AS NVLD- WE ARE STRUGGLING WITH HER SOCIAL SKILLS AND AWARENESS OF SOCIAL SITUATIONS AND WHAT IS TYPICAL AND NOT TYPICAL. CAN YOU TELL ME WHERE THE COLLEGES ARE LOCATED THAT EITHER YOUR CHILD OR YOURSELF HAVE ATTENDED OR CURRENTLY ATTEND? I AM ALSO AT A LOSS OF WHAT TO DO- SHE CURRENTLY DOES SEE A PSYCHIATRIST FOR ANXIETY AND ADD AND HAS BECOME COGNITIVE BEHAVIOR THERAPY- THANKS IN ADVANCE-JESSICA MOORE
Jessica, it’s a good idea to write in mixed case, not ALL UPPER CASE as you did above. It’s not only easier to read, it’s better form on the internet. Thanks.
Hello! To all,
First of all I would like to say “Im British, living in the UK” and the reason why I say this will become very clear in a momment. When I first read about NVLD I almost fell off my chair in shock and surprise! It is because I definatly fit a diagnosis of NVLD despite having various assessments conducted by neuropsychologists where in one of the reports states “a right hemisphere developmental problem” and the fact that whielst I was growing up (Im 29 now and studying social sciences at university), I kept on saying to my G.P/ Primary care provider, that I could feel the difference between my left and right side of my body, no-one has come up with the diagnosis of NVLD. Also there are no English or Europian sources about NVLD, hence why Im typing my comments here. And what is even more dissapointing is the fact that us Brits in the medical profession seem seem to be decades behind the U.S and Canada in simply connecting and accepting that learning difficulties and mental health issues can be purley down to how a persons brain is wired!
In my case I have a diagnosis of Dysthimia (Chronic depression) to deal with as-well, but personally I have come to the conclusion that my Dysthimia is largley due to the neurological/neuro-chemical problems of having NVLD because I have responded extreamly well to medication alone, and any other risidual problems are the educational, and social effects of having NVLD. Does anyone else feel this way? Also my biggest emotional/psychological problem, which I get very fustrated about is that I kind of live in a in between world, because I appear to be a “normal” (I hate that phrase) functioning person and Im perfectly sane, but because of the NVLD I can never live life to the full socialy or educationaly, so I cant quite compete with other people. Does anyone else feel this way? But this is where I change from a negative, moaning old Brit, and turn into a social scientist! As people we are naturaly concerned by what people think of us, so instead of us moaning about the rough deal we have we should embrace our uniqueness, because as much as this condition is a curse it is also a gift because we can see things from a different perspective and we have enhanced skills! So we just need to project that we have pride in ourselfs and that we love ourselfs for who and how we are, and these, so called “normal” people will be proud and interested in us and what we can achieve!
Kelly: Amen.
Hello,
I recently was told by a counselor that my profile falls into the category of NVLD. However, I have a few questions about this, primarily because I don’t feel as if I share many of the characteristics of someone with NVLD. I do have a large discrepancy between my verbal and performance IQ (in favor of verbal), I have terrible visual-spatial skills, poor visual memory, and weaknesses in other areas.
I have done relatively well in school, having recently obtained a graduate degree in Learning Disabilities (though, I have to work twice as hard as everybody). However, I have been fired from a professional job out of college, and quit two others because I felt as if I was going to be fired again.
I guess my main question is, it seems that social problems are a primary symptom of NVLD, but I don’t feel that I really experience this at all. I have had many friends over my lifetime and no teacher, friend, or colleague has ever noticed anything out of the ordinary. I do have generalized anxiety, and some social anxiety — though I attribute this to the weakness listed above. I have no problem reading other people (I am sure I am not amazing at it, but I don’t think I am below average), and I have no problem empathizing with others.
Does anyone have a profile that is similar to this, and still have a NVLD diagnosis? Please email me if you can help clarify this for me. Thanks!
teebee77@gmail.com
Hi All,
My husband and I were told yesterday that our 14 year old son has a NVLD his scores are 60 points different between verbal and non-verbal. We are scared and at a loss of what to do. He is leaving the 8th grade next week and was going to go to the Tec school, now the councler is saying that might not be a good idea, he could not pass. He has a younger sister that has PPD-NOS Autism, and has been is special ed all her life. We see how she has struggled and how the school treats her and am afraid for him.
He is extreamly angry over the death of his birth mother, 5years ago, and on lots of meds for depression. I am thinking that some of the anger might be because he has such a hard time with school and with social situations. He has very few freinds, but lots of aquantances. As I saw in many of the past post he also never uses the phone, has a hard time reading peoples faces, we have to tell him many times about simple tasks he has done all his life. I think he is going to do well in life, but with our helping him along the way. He sees a great therapist in Southeastern CT, who was the one to suggest the testing so we would know what we were dealing with.
My questions are what should we do next? and How do you tell him? We love our son and want the best for him, but how do you tell a child who only wants to drive that he may never be able to do so?
Bridget,
60 points is a incredibly rare discrepancy. I hope you understand that such a split between verbal and perceptual on an IQ test is not an automatic litmus test for NVLD. Your other descriptions do suggest NVLD, but anxiety, depression and drug use can also be great contributors.
Please make sure you have all the information you need before changing plans on the Tech school option if this is what he’s motivated towards, just because someone says he “can’t pass.”
I am really glad I found you! I hope the following is helpful, Bridget.
My advice to you is whatever you do, -whatever you do-, empower your son. He probably knows there’s something not right.
He needs to be armed with knowledge. Let him know what he’s facing, but don’t let him use it as a crutch.
I have siblings who have a host of learning disabilites, but I was sort of the lost child, never tested. In fact, I was deaf until the first grade, and no one ever knew it, so I have problems relating to that, too. My failures in school were attibuted to my being lazy. Without much effort, I could get A’s in classes which had to do with writing. All standardized tests I ever took showed the same pattern, very high verbal, very low math.
When I was in my thirties, I was tutoring a student with severe learning disabilites. I figured, “hey, alot of what he’s dealing with looks very familiar… I wonder if…?”
I got tested, and found out that I have a fifty point spread in my IQ, in the pattern that is suggestive of NVLD. (high verbal, low visual processing, among other symptoms including self cueing, etc.).
Now, I think in a way, I was better off for all those years to believe that I just wasn’t trying hard enough. In part, that is the truth. A normal effort will not be sufficient in my case. It never will. I have to put in ten times the amount of effort on many things to get at least the same result as so called normal people. But there are things I can do and understand that so called normal people struggle with, or never get at all.
I have two Bacchelor’s degrees, one in Theater and one in Geology. I am a published author and playwright (no, you wouldn’t have heard of me…yet.) and a black belt. I can make entire groups of people laugh or cry or cringe in fear with my writing. I make a mean gazpacho and can even juggle, knit, play guitar and bass. I just signed up for my first road race (a 5 k in September). I rescue kittens and lift up people when they’re down. I’m 42.
I am finishing up my MS in Geology and I am working on an MA to become a high school teacher. (I taught as a grad student. I have an idea of what I’m in for. I think…. We’ll see.)
Anyway, don’t give into fear. No, he doesn’t have an easy road, but if he chooses, he has a great and unique and beautiful road.
He needs a good support system, he needs to believe in himself, I think that’s the biggest challenge. But, he also needs to be ready to go out there and do battle with a world that isn’t going to give him any breaks. And at the end of the day, when he is standing with a goofy, triumphant smile on his face, in the middle of his field of victory, he’ll be glad that it didn’t.
I often think about one of my favorite sayings, which is from Galaxy Quest: Never give up, Never surrender!
Take care,
Penny
Hi all – Just reading through these posts has aspects of the positive and the negative. Bridget, I have a 14 yo daughter who was just diagnosed this year with NLD as well. It was difficult at first to deal with, but I recognize, like you, that with our help I think she will live a relatively normal life. I also have looked inside myself and see that both my husband and I have some aspects of her personality. I debated about how/what to tell her, but we did tell her of her diagnosis. I do believe that explaining how her mind works and helping her learn the skills necessary to cope with any deficit will help. My daughter LOVES the computer. She’s been playing around with binary code creating game characters for several years, and I have just allowed her to create a “bulletin board” where she can chat with friends that she’s made online (nothing personal, she frequently asks me to read things she’s written or received). I believe that in some ways it has been a benefit to her socially – in that it’s a slower pace, but it helps her to understand how to interact with her classmates in the real world. I too have concerns about her ability to find her way around when she becomes ready to drive, but at this point she doesn’t want to drive. I think if your son really wants to be able to do so, he probably will do fine. Unfortunately, a lot of what I initially read about NLD made it sound as though these children and adults would need to have someone holding their hands even to find a bus at school, but I think that it really depends upon the severity of the disability. My daughter is quiet, but can be boisterous when she’s in her comfort zone. Routine is very important in helping these kids feel in control, and advance notice is very helpful when a routine is about to be changed spontaneously. I learned early on, well before a diagnosis – that this daughter needs a little extra tlc – even though it seems that she’s very self-centered. That is something that just goes with the territory, but we have to learn not to take it personally as these kids are not trying to be selfish. I frequently catch her doing selfless things – they’re just not always the things that *I* think are most important! (I also have a 12 year old daughter who has no LD whatsoever, but who has probably played an important role in helping her older sister adapt.) At any rate, best you can do is give him the love and support, encourage him to do his best and be an advocate for him with his teachers. Since we were diagnosed half way through the school year, it is my intention to write down some of the struggles we faced this year along with suggestions of how to better help her overcome them and give it to each of her new teachers when we meet at the high school’s open house in the fall.
Hi Everyone,
Thanks so much, Your comments have really helped. with his Therapist we did tell him there was something on his test results that we needed to look into further, and we would be doing more testing. When we had the Correct and Final results we would talk with him and give him the news. We think this is the correct coarse for him, with the other things going on, and the medications that he is on, I think this is a good way to go.
I have set up appointments with his Psyche, and a neurologist to do some more testing. We talked to the school and they are going to flag him for more testing in the Fall when school first starts. They are going to set up a PPT for the beginning of September, and I will be there to advocate for him. I am glad I found this site and the supportive people on it.
Bridget,
He’s lucky to have parents like you, and if I ever have a child with LD, I will handle it in the way you just described. Good luck!
Penny
Robert,
I also have a nonverbal learning disability and I was diagnosed at 4 years of age due to the motor problems and I was already receiving intervention. I am 20 years old now and I am in college. I am from Montreal, Quebec.
For years I have always wanted to be an early childhood educator but I have problems with social skills. I was wondering if this profession would be a hindrance. I also am interested in working with other people with similar problems. I think that I would do much better with working with people in a 1 to 1 situation such as peer tutoring somebody who has trouble with reading or something like that. I also would really like to meet somebody with nvld preferably a young adult.
Vivian
Hello all. My son was diagnosed with a NVLD at age 16 and has refused to accept the diagnosis. Though he was placed in an outward bound program (Summit Achievement Academy in Maine) and did extremely well, he has been crashing the past three years. He did complete high school and one year of community college but is now getting into major problems that involve the law. Does anyone have any knowledge of an adult “camp” or school that I can check out. I know his self esteem is suffering and he does these things for attention from peers but at age 20, the implications for long term legal issues is daunting and I need to get him help (even though he doesn’t want it). Any information would be appreciated. Thank you all so much and prayers and blessings go with you all on these journeys!
My name is Q, and I have a complex, seemingly impossible story that I would not believe to be true had I not lived it. Let me explain. I have found this resource very helpful, so I would really appreciate your feedback.
Here is what I know:
- I’m in my mid 30s and have always felt that something was seriously amiss with my learning process, specifically my processing speed/cognitive flexibility/comprehension. I just struggled where others seemed to glide through life — picture a bunch of ducks on a calm pond, but one is paddling 10X as hard to keep up. I felt like my brain was made of teflon — nothing stuck to it, regardless of the experiences I had…problems with organizing, planning, etc.
- About 10 years ago and then again 3 years ago, I had extensive neuropsychological testing, which revealed that I had an obvious profile of verbal strengths and nonverbal weaknesses. My VIQ was 23 points higher than my PIQ, although both scores were in the average to superior for my educational background. The problem was the discrepancy, which seemingly creates some sort of inner turmoil. I also showed severe impairment on various tasks regarding visual spatial/right hemisphere processing. The conclusion was that I had some sort of processing disorder like NVLD.
- Although I have always felt something was wrong, I have suffered privately and been able to move through my life without severe disruption (aside from severe anxiety waiting for it all to fall apart). I graduated from college with outstanding grades (like almost perfect GPA, and I took all kinds of math classes like calculus and statistics). Everyone I know thinks I’m a smart, well-adjusted person. I have always been employed and have kept jobs for long periods of time. I am currently in a job that pays very very well, and somehow I’m able to keep this all going. Frankly, this is a huge mystery to me and makes me wonder whether my diagnosis is accurate.
- I have met with several therapists and psychologists over the years and recently, but I have not found anyone that takes my situation seriously, other than diagnosing generalized anxiety. But the anxiety is secondary to something else – this NVLD or whatever it is.
- About 7 years ago, I met and fell totally in love with a wonderful woman that I married. We have two adorable little kids who, seemingly, are perfect in every way. They are only 4 and 2.
…so here is the source of my current anxiety.
1) I never specifically, explicitly told my wife that I had these concerns before we got married, so I am wracked with guilt. Would we have gotten married? Honestly, I didn’t even know what to tell her, since there was no specific diagnosis and I had always done well – there’s not been a day when i didn’t have a paycheck. There’s no doubt I should have told her everything. We’ve talked about this since we’ve been married, but she says, “congratulations, you’re like everyone else in that you have strengths and weaknesses”. She has much more confidence in me than I have in myself.
2) I am concerned about my kids. I don’t want them to feel the way that I’ve felt for so long, struggling to fit it and confused. Whenever they struggle with something, I wonder…for a long time, I didn’t want kids because I was concerned about this issue being passed on. Yes – i know that’s a pretty dramatic stance.
I’m actually having irrational thoughts, and I’m going to seek out some help (because I know they’re irrational)….some of these include:
- regret getting married and even having kids
- wishing my “disorder” was more severe, so at least I didn’t seem OK to everyone on the outside, but struggle in silence.
And all the while, I’m living my life, working, doing the best I can. But sometimes my anxiety really flares up and I have physical symptoms (can’t sleep, sweating)…I tend to envision the worst case scenarios unfortunately. i’m trying to focus on the many positive things in my life, but its hard…
Thoughts?
Follow-up comment -
I’m not so delusional that I don’t realize I have a wonderful life and many things to be thankful for….I LOVE my wife and my kids. my (irrational?) anxiety is about LOSING these things or not being able to provide for my family.
maybe this will never happen and i’ll be 90 years old and have pulled off one of the greatest stunts in history of the world. but the fact that I feel this way shows something is really wrong….
Final post and then I’ll hopefully just read your comments….
Is there ANYTHING i should/could observe regarding my kids that would indicate whether something is wrong or could indicate NVLD.
I’m actually scared of how subtle (from the outside), yet severe (on the inside) my case is….i don’t understand how i could go through the entire school system plus college without anyone noticing anything was wrong…how is this possible? why wouldn’t someone pull me “out of line” as a kid and see I wasn’t really comprehending things fully. could my strong verbal skills really take me THAT far?
My son, now 16 and a senior in high school, continues to teach us about NLD everyday. Until neuropsychological testing last year, he was classified in special ed as having only a learning disability in written expression. After the testing, and putting the whole picture together, we try to approach everything everyday in small steps, using repetition and written and verbal communication. He struggles in school, and after failing/dropping chemistry mid-year, he ended up on the honor roll for the first time. Our last IEP meeting with the district lasted 5 hours, which is cruel to do to parents. They admitted our son is the only one in the dsictrict with this disability and they don’t think he needs accommodations. They were hoping to wear us down and get us to stop asking for accoomoodations. We got the IEP he needs, now the struggle will be getting the distict to implement it. I feel that if we don’t fight for our son now, he won’t have a chance to fight for himself when he’s older. If they could just see the hard work that goes on inside his head!
Response to Q-
I am a 42 yo male who has a 11 yo daughter who was diagnosed with NVLD 3 years ago. While she has some of the academic struggles particularly in math, she does well socially and has good coordination. She does not “fit” the whole pattern. Anyway, her diagnosis prompted me to explore my own past. I was aware that I had LD as a kid, was quite anxious, and had very poor coordination as well as, I believe social skills.
I recently aquired my childhood educational testing, which documented problems with visual spacial skills. However the results were scant at best. I have wondered if this LD was passed on to her. I may never know for certain.
At any rate, I too have 2 children, am happily married and work as a Pscyhotherapist. It is ironic bc the literature would argue that this is not an ideal career choice for someone with NVLD. However, I believe I learned to compensate for these weaknesses over time. I also believe that my daughter is doing the same thing. Thus, she is not struggling in some arenas while more so in others. She had a testing profile similar to yours. A Neuropsychologist I spoke with recently said that if there is a superior VIQ the person may compensate. Anxiety is part of the whole nvld profile though, bc we are always working hard to compensate, to talk ourselves through everything.
I guess I would say your anxiety is normal. You are just aware you are working hard to be okay. Your kids may very well be okay even if they have your strengths/weaknesses. You may want to explore some cognitive behavioral therapy to learn to manage your very real anxiety. But you are more okay than you think you are.
Take care of yourself.
My story is one of frustration and disappointment in life. In addition to NLD, I believe I also have a verbal LD of some kind, which makes it hard for me to organize my thoughts in speech and writing. So please forgive my rambling. I admire the clear writing skills so many of you have, including Q: you express yourself so well.
I am a 47-y.o. woman who 2 years ago was tested by the psychologist at the local Vocational Rehab. office. While the results showed a math disability, dysthymia, and relationship dysfunction, among other things, the doc. stopped short of a NLD diagnosis. I was seeing a counselor along with my 3 children, 2 of whom were diagnosed as NLD shortly before. Based on all this put together, the counselor thinks I also have NLD.
Finally, a name for the symptoms I had recognized all my life! I believe no one suspected I was struggling; it was truly a “hidden” disability in me. Some of the first emotions I remember from early childhood are shame, guilt, and embarrassment at getting things mixed up. Also extreme shyness, social anxiety and feelings of loneliness and disconnectedness. To top it off, my family was fairly non-communicative. We didn’t talk about important things, conversations were non-existent, self-expression was unheard-of. I didn’t even know I had feelings until I began to feel angry and irritable in junior high. Then I felt ashamed of my irritability, since “good girls” don’t feel that way. And I was a good girl; I always did what was expected of me.
In high school, I scraped by in math and science but did well in the verbal and rote-memory subjects. In typing class, my brain knew where the letter keys were, but my fingers didn’t always go there. I played first chair flute in band, and no matter how much I practiced, my fingers often didn’t go where they should. I always wondered what was wrong with me and why I made mistakes when I knew the fingerings. I cadet-taught in kindergarten class, and there felt awkward and stupid, as taking initiative in tasks was very hard for me.
I graduated from H.S. in the top 10, (small school) Honor Society, etc.. I had been invited to represent my school in several leadership-type programs, and each time I felt out of place and had no idea what to do once I was there. I went on to university with an interest in French, but undecided as to major. I finally settled on speech/language pathology and audiology, as this incorporated my interests in language and teaching. As in high school, I did well, but when I had to do clinical practice, I began having doubts and even had a supervisor say I would need extra supervision in grad school. Also in college I held a cafeteria job where my supervisor told me he had expected me to be better at the job than I was. By this time, I started to feel depressed and had suicidal thoughts. Though I had friends, I felt isolated and like no one understood me.
In grad. school, in speech path., class performance and grades were fine, but when I needed to put what I learned into practice, I blanked out. I thought of it as “trouble thinking on my feet”. Then, even though I hated standing in front of people to talk, I changed my major to teaching English as a foreign language and Spanish. I taught ESL at the university, not unsuccessfully.
I got a job teaching EFL in South America. There I enjoyed my students, but had no idea how to plan my lessons. I had trouble developing new teaching materials as I was expected to do. I began to realize that I had no creativity. I had so much trouble with breaking down a task into its parts, organizing my ideas and making time in my schedule to prepare my lessons. I met a man, fell “in love” and married within 10 months. I had had no experience in relationships with men, and since I didn’t know how to communicate, I didn’t even realize that communication was lacking in our relationship. I did become fluent in Spanish, though! Bringing him home to the States, things began to fall apart. 10 years and 3 kids later, we were divorced.
Meanwhile, I taught English composition at the university, disliking nearly every minute of it, for 6 years. Planning, grading papers, even organizing my desk were a nightmare. Finally I was let go. I went back to school for Spanish teaching, and had a terrible time in student teaching. I decided I hated teaching, and having 3 kids by now and divorced, what was I to do? I lived off my parents’ good will and money till 4 years later, met and married a man within 4 weeks. I didn’t want to admit it then, but I was trying to escape the dependence on my parents. I naively believed I could make it with a total stranger! I supported him in his business, got deeply in debt, was cheated on and put up with his alcoholism. I am worse off in a worldly sense, but I am much wiser than I used to be.
Now separated, and going through peri-menopause, I am the most depressed of my entire life. I have gone to counseling and taken anti-depressants off and on for the past 15 years. No one ever knew the cause of my depression was a learning disorder till now. Even now, my counselor doesn’t seem to know how to help me. I have no self-esteem, know of no employable skills, and I am raising 3 kids (2 teens), and dependent on my parents again. My house is a cluttered mess and I feel paralyzed to improve it.
Counseling had never eased my depression. Medication dulls the depression but does not help me be more productive. I’m ready to try it again, though. Isn’t there something else that can help me?
This story is very depressing and not so positive for a recent college graduate looking for a career. Does anyone have any actual success stories to relate to? Many of those I have read online deemed “success stories” for people with NVLD are not quite so inspiring. All I want is guidance and some example of someone with a good career who happens to have NVLD.
Any help or inspiration?
Hi. My daughter has not been officially diagnosed yet, but at the suggestion of her new therapist she will be tested soon. She is a college freshman who made it through hs with much pushing and support from the family. She failed her first college semester and that is when she started seeing a therapist because she was so depressed. NVLD characteristics fit likewise a glove except for 2 things, she is visually artistic. Drawing and computer assisted drawing including fine tiny details are her specialty. She also can analyze literature and recognize underlying meanings. She does miss body languages , gestures and tone However. Social aspects fit, math issues, memorizes formulas but doesn’t know where to apply them. In college her problem was that once she left the classroom she didn’t do any of the written assignments or homework. She totally understood the material just coulndt get motivated to do the work. Perhaps the depression was an additional. Factor. She is currently back home and at community collegetaking all studio art classes and CLEP exams where possible. Her great memory works well for multiple choice tests. But I am really worried about her success long term. Does anyone know of colleges that have programs for kids with nvld or of support groups for adults?
Dear Leigh,
The good news is that (hopefully) your daughter is on the way to get some answers and insights as to her learning profile. It may be that she has NVLD or perhaps some level of Asperger’s Syndrome. Though there are differences between the two, there are certain overlaps as well. A good evaluation should be able to tease that all apart.
One of the things I’ve noticed is that people whose processing differences make it hard to recognize emotional cues in others, also struggle to recognize (quickly) their own distress and other signals. That’s why they can be extra prone towards anxiety, depression and/or self-harm. When the signals of stress and distress finally make their way in, sometimes it’s in a big way.
There are an increasing number of colleges who can offer supportive services (academic and psycho-social). Equally important is for you and your daughter to learn her strengths and weaknesses (again, hopefully from this upcoming evaluation) in a deep and meaningful way. This can help her to develop self-advocacy skills and a proactive mindset.
Colleges and programs can deliver pieces of the right support but it’s the student who can make it all work.
There are educational consultants who can assist you in making good matches (colleges) but you’d want to complete the evaluation process first. It’s important that your daughter have some success, even small ones that she can build on (such as the studio art) before making next steps.
Let me know if I can help you locate a college LD specialist who can help you and your daughter.
I am looking for ways to cope with or overcome NLVD. I have read that nlvd is often the result of injury or pathology.
First: Have there been any studies looking to see if the “injured” part of the brain can be trained to compensate, or go around, the cause of the difficulty? You hear about people with brain injuries basically growing neurons which eventually take the place of the injured area. Have there been any studies to check this out? (I suppose you could call it brain training)
Second: What about intensive courses in body language training? I know such courses exist to help people in sales positions. Or courses designed specifically for adults with NLVD to teach social skills and norms?
It seems to me that these sorts of things might work. My son has NLVD and as he has gotten older he has progressed socially and is hanging scholastically in college. He read a book on body language and it has helped him. He now has quite a few friends (he had zero social life by the end of high school). He is not doing so well with romance even though he is good looking (by any account, not just his mom’s!)
I will do whatever it takes to help him – I’d just like to know what else. (I already provide considerable emotional support, and I know that helps him to keep trying)
Does anyone have any knowledge of or experience with the above possibilities?
Kim,
Thanks for writing in. My experience with NVLD is with folks who didn’t have causative injuries although I’m not sure that matters unless the injury or illness created other challenges.
There’s increasing discussion about brain training and while I don’t doubt that eventually we’ll see some hard evidence, I haven’t yet seen it. Two promising areas I’ve heard of that seem to have something behind them is Arrowsmith School in Canada, and Cogmed.
Sounds like your son is making some good headway overall. Dating and romance are often challenging in general, and full of growth opportunities. There’s some work going on at Keene State College where they are using student mentors along with a faculty member, to guide students with NLD or Asperger profiles, in the area of dating. Might be worth looking into.
Hello all,
I’m glad to see that this LD Resources thread is still active. I am recently self-diagnosed with NVLD. I have two friends who told me they had NVLD, so I looked it up on the web, and voila, there I was! Nice to feel I belong somewhere, at last. I have the following “issues:” got in trouble as a kid for talking too much, and everyone thought I was oh, so bright – enough so that my mother pushed to have me skip sixth grade. I did, and everything was OK for the first year, but the summer after seventh grade, I crashed and burned socially big time. Up until then it didn’t seem so important to say and do things exactly right. I spent endless hours writing in my journal, trying verbally to figure out what I was doing wrong, analyzing everything to death but rarely coming up with any solutions that worked. Meanwhile, I was also “the last picked” for any sports activity, except for bowling (where you can stop and plan and adjust before making any moves). Fast forward to the present. I am now 67. I’ve never had a romantic relationship that lasted longer than two years (one). I have always had severe balance issues and acrophobia, and passing other cars on a narrow street scares me. I have been successful in my career. I taught regular elementary school for awhile and then became a teacher of kids with visual impairments. I have done well here, except for a stint trying to run a high school class for VI kids, which proved disastrous all around.
I think my sister also has NVLD – the same balance and spatial issues I have plus being remarkably dense socially. And my mother too.
I am very interested in connecting with and interacting with other older adults with NVLD. I’d love to hear your stories of how you’ve made it through the years and to share mine.
Hi Sue,
Thanks for writing in. I’m glad the description of NVLD works to contextualize your longstanding difficulties, and perhaps your strengths.
It’s interesting that you were drawn to, and wound up working with kids who have non-verbal challenges.
There’s so much neurological variance in the world and it’s never too late to figure out your style.
Good luck with it all.
Hello i read ever one story. I have learning dsability that call dyslexia. i did not no i had it until gradate from college. as a kid it was a struggle for me. i wa in special educaton from 1-12 grade. they told me college was not for me but went. i us to get beat by my aunt becasue i could not read are do math kid made fun of me call me LD special ed kid. it hurt but i us all that to reach goal. so i tell all of you dont give up. i start my own foundation.
Hello,
My name is Robert, I am 27yr… I was diganosed with a medulloblostoma brain tumor when I was 5yrs old. Had surgery, chemotherapy, and radiation… i ended up with a bilateral neurosensorial hearing loss due to the cisplatin chemotherapy. I had problems socially and with math as a student. I was always told I was very bright as a student. My 2nd year of college I had trouble focusing, and was diagnosed with a Non-verbal learning disorder, was administered adderall, with the initial thought I had ADD… it did help somewhat on focusing, but I still have problems with in college. I managed to graduate with a Bachelors Degree in Biology with a 3.0, along with minors in chemistry and spanish. I’ve been told im extremely bright, but I still have problems with employment, that I got laid off in my first biotech job, partly to do with my math skills and social skills. I wish there was help for adults with non-verbal learning disorder… I’m thinking about changing my career to nursing, but that is hard, i’ve done poorly on my lab practicals in my anatomy course.
Robert
Hi Robert.
Thanks for writing in. I appreciate all you’ve been through and especially how you’ve managed to progress along, in spite of your difficulties.
What makes you think about nursing?
Let us know how you’re doing and keep tuning in here, you may find some useful info or suggestions.