How much do you push handwriting for a dysgraphic student?
Monday, January 26th, 2004
A student has poor handwriting caused by dysgraphia. He has access to computers and portable keyboards (AlphaSmarts and others) but his teachers are pushing him to continue to work on his handwriting skills.
The problem is that his handwriting is so slow and painful that he can’t do any formal work with pencil and paper.
How do you balance work on basic skills while at the same time giving him the use of technology to more quickly and easily get his work done?
Also, what happens when he’s reluctant to use the technology because it “outs” him as an LD student?
What do people do when the 7/8th grade middle school student with dysgraphia, hard to read handwriting and full of spelling and mech. errors, refuses to use a computer to assist with writing assignments unless told to? This kid can use a keyboard with good speed and knows how to use a word proc..
Parents say the child complains that they don’t need it, or does not want to use it at school, quicker to complete using pencil, and none of the classmates use one so they are doing something different from their peer group. Student hates the AlphaSmart and won’t even think of a Dana. Was a successful user yrs ago. Basically just wants to do what classmates do and what they want, even if it means turning in what many people would think is a messy, messy paper. Parents say not to accept these papers if they cannot be read or to many errors.
How far do you push or do you just let the kid write using paper and pencil and hope as they get older they will move on? Attitude seems negative and sick of specialists telling to use a computer. Handwriting is functional but messy, and full of writing errors. Often parts of notes cannot be read so copies are essential. This kid also will not speak up and request anything, teachers complain that waits for them to make the first move. Teachers complain no effort, lazy. but could do work if tried harder.
This kid has plenty of documentation to support but lack of usage is their choice. Push accomm. or forgot about till their invested?
Ashlely,
Help me for a moment here. I assume you are one of his teachers?
If I were a teacher and had a student in this situation with “functional but messy” handwriting, I’d just accept the paper. If you can read it, is there a problem?
As for the other teachers complaining…are they complaining to you? To the student? The parents? I’m confused here….Are you his case manger?
If he’s doing the work and it can be read I just really, really don’t see a problem. My non-LD son is in 7th grade. It is of upmost importance for him to fit in. I suspect your student will go back to word processing after he figures out how he fits in.
Barb
PS—No liking the Alpha or Dana has come up on a parenting board I fequent. Its not that those are not wonderful machines but that sometimes a “sped ed only dummies use these” label get attached to them. Several parents have found that a cheap laptop is the answer. The other kids consider them cool. This might be an idea for this student.
As someone who is dysgraphic I can tell you this:
1. Had I spent more time on handwriting earlier on my handwriting might (I repeat, might) have gotten a bit better but dysgraphia puts a cap on how far I could have gone. I will never know for sure but I know I could have improved a bit.
2. Now that there are tools like AlphaSmarts around (simple, inexpensive keyboards) the question is (stigma aside for a second): If you give someone struggling with handwriting a tool the eliminates it and he uses the tool, what happens to handwriting?
#2 begs the question: is handwriting a skill that has meaning in and of itself or is it a means to another end, and if the latter, what is that end?
I would think that for the most part, handwriting does not stand on its own. I’d go further to say that keyboarding doesn’t either.
Both are means’ to other ends: writing and one might go further when discussing spelling and syntax and say that they too are means’ to other ends: communication (and going even further, communication is a means to the end of the action one expects from the communication).
Now for the stigma piece.
Stigma is about association. If the cool kids at school started using AlphaSmarts they would no longer be seen as special ed dummy tools. I know it doesn’t help to note that Arthur Miller (playwrite) uses one or that hundreds of professional writers use them daily; it only matter what the people in the micro-culture of one school and even one classroom use.
Choice: look like a fool with poor handwriting or carry around an AlphaSmart and have a larger advertisement?
No brainer. Chuck the AlphaSmart and handwrite as little as possible.
So, would a Dana solve this or a PDA? Not sure. Stigma and social stuff is age related too. If the kids doing the judging have never seen a PDA it has no cache. Of course, many have never seen an AlphaSmart either but they do see that it is taken out of the special ed closet and so, must be a dummy tool.
Short solution: forget which money paid for it; keep it in a more general, non-stigma producing area of the school and get teachers and the principal to use it.
Sorry, this is a most interesting topic to me.
I think the short answer is balance:
1. Spend a bit of time daily doing some handwriting by hand. Nothing fancy or formal and maybe not even for school but just keep the skill alive (I do not do this; I am 52).
2. Use a keyboard of some sort for all involved and formal communication where the idea rules, not the process.
3. Learn to use both a yellow pad and an AlphaSmart to take notes. Also learn to use a tape recorder in addition.
4. Understand the social variable and always keep it in mind.
Richard,
I am not sure I understand #3, are you writing single the student out and require them to too use a keyboard for formal times, or just let the student know it is available?
You sure are right about the sped thing, if we all used them at times they would not be looked at that way. I think that is what has done this kid in. The social stigma is overwhelming and nothing is more awful to them than to hear their name called to go and use the computer in class when everyone else is using paper and pencil. (forgot about trying to change that, once in awhile you might catch a teacher but the reality is the environment is not tech usage unless a special event such as lab or laptop cart is brought in for a special assignment).
The postings are helpful and will help me with this kid – thanks!
Sorry, this one I am confused on. Do you lay back and let them labor using paper/pencil or require them on what you wrote as formal? The require part is what has caused this kid to get an “attitude”. No one else has to so it looks like extra work and they are singled out – which is the biggest thing. Each teacher has a different comfort level on it which brings huge inconsistencies. We know using a word proc. brings a neater product with less spelling and mech. errors.
I say let them go with their choice of tools – but not sure if this is the right thing to do. Seems like the social well being is more important at this time and flags are flying everywhere to lay off since “they do not have a problem with their handwriting, it is other people that do”.
Let them go with their choice of tools but make sure that you help broaden what they see as choices:
- yellow pad and pen
- AlphaSmart
- Tape recorder
- etc.
The important thing is for them to get into a pattern of recording ideas so that they can look at them later and participate down the road in discussion, paper writing, tests, etc.
No recording, too much reliance on memory which is not always so great.
Thanks for the great idea’s and viewpoint. I especially like the focus on:
I’ll share this site and references with others, a great resource and support.
Why push for something that exists and the child refuses??
You say the handwriting is functional – but then u say it’s hard to read –
When does it become hard to read?? Is he getting tired – dysgraphia’s fatigue – will a slant board help??
He has acommodations that he doesn’t want… how about some he may utilize that weren’t offered because he wasn’t asked or doesn’t know they exist?
Which is easier for him print or cursive – which is more legible – is extra time allowed on class assignments and or tests?
Was he given the option to do written homework assignments on the computer?
Is this child part of the team discussions (CSE or otherwise)
Have teachers worked with the child to come up with suggestions together that would be a positive outcome?
Teachers influence childrens lives – when they go out of their way to help them… unfortunately many of those teachers don’t exist…
BUT: Teachers can make certain allowances that only the child and teacher/s are aware of.
We all have weakness’s and seems like this child is coping with his- what’s the problem here?
I don’t know the child – but seems like he wants to put his disability aside and be a regular kid – help him be that kid!
When grammer/syntax is a problem…. write what the error is and give a written explaination on the error and how to fix it.
Give some extra credit work to reinforce the skill…
Do all you can to encourage the child – and help him help himself!
I’m a mom with a dysgraphic child – who would take the assisitive technology in a heartbeat! he’s in 5th grade. and it’s a LONGGGGGGGG story!
Good luck!
Mary Anne
I am the parent of a dylsexic, dysgraphic, and disorganized 15 yr. old 10th grader. He used an Alpha Smart in 5th grader after being identified and a computer and was quite successful with it. Then in middle school the teachers were resistant to him using the technology and he didn’t like being different. His IQ score is in the superior range and he is currently taking all honors classes in high school. I wish I had pushed the technology more with the schools because he cannot have any accomodations on his SAT tests or AP tests than he uses at the school. Danny has typically done papers at home by dictating them to me – this does not make him an independent learner. I purchased Dragon Naturally Speaking at home which was good for a while but now his voice is cracking and is destroying his voice files which leads to great frustration and he resists using it. He also doesn’t have support for it at school. It is heart breaking to hear teachers say that he would be an excellent AP candidate but that they don’t think he could apss the essay portion of the AP tests. He wants to go to college, but does not seem to grasp that he needs to be completely independent in his learning to do so. Having the teachers and school resist the technology makes it doubly hard for him – but it is necessary for the student to qualify for the needed accommodations on the high stakes tests. He has passed the Virginia SOL tests with advanced scores except for the English writing – which he barely passed in 8th grade and hasn’t taken yet for HS. If he doesn’t pass it – he cannot get a regular diploma. He needs those accommodations as a part of his regular school program so that he has them for the tests. I would settle for even a scribe at this point – so that he is capable of getting his thoughts on paper. But technology makes him much more independent – even if they don’t like the stigma.
Melia: I think there will be a college for Danny, you just have to dig around. I agree with you though: if one depends too heavily on technology for everything it will make it harder to work independently. However, many colleges will allow him to take almost all if not all tests on a computer or AlphaSmart keyboard to get around the handwriting problems and he should be able to take the SAT with a reader for sure, not sure about a scribe.
I do agree though, not being able to write without a keyboard makes life difficult for a student and that’s going to be the rule for some time to come.
At some point everyone will be using technology and the stigma will be minimized.
Melia,
Maybe it’s time to push again, this time to ensure that whatever AT accommodations he qualifies for (like the ability to use a laptop for the SAT, writing portion), he receives. I think you can focus on adjusting his IEP so that it states the need and/or have him re-evaluated (a psycho-educational battery) if you think it will demonstrate the need. There should be a specific recommendation written into the report about the need for that type of AT. This’ll enable him to get that on those portions of the SAT. He’ll need something like this anyways, in order to qualify for ed. services in college.
Good luck.
I can’t help but respond. For anyone out there that has a child with dysgraphia they can do it – you can do it. My son just graduated with honors and will be attending a state university that is difficult to get into. He has dysgraphia and has had a 504 plan in place for him. Without a doubt he has dysgraphia – very poor handwriting & spelling and he excells in all testing areas, but spelling. Here there is a dramatic drop, unless he has use of a spell checker and that is only good so far. I understand how hard it can be, but keep advocating for them and teach them to advocate for themselves. For those in high school it is especially important so that you can get any needed accomodations in place for the SAT. As my son enters college we will need to have him retested and start the process of accomodations here. We can do it.
I’m looking for suggestions. Not only does my son have dysgraphia, but he seems to have a great deal of difficulty using a keyboard due to his apparent difficulty in organizing his thoughts as well as difficulty spelling presumably due to his ADD/HD. Even with meds, he has problems focusing, concentrating, etc.
His behavior, concentration and all is much better with the meds, but to get him to a truly “therapeutic” dose, he’s had an increase in side effects. He’s already very small and underweight for his age, and he gets very labile when we increase any more of the meds.
Sooo, I’m looking for suggestions for AT, OT to help with his production of classwork. His school hasn’t been very accomodating and they are making noises that he needs a self-contained Asperger’s classroom, etc. Of course, they blame me for him earning poor grades despite a well above average IQ. Help appreciated.
Carol, how about either a tape recorder or a digital voice recorder? He can record his thoughts and then you and/or his teacher can help him transcribe them into text on a computer.
I’ve used both tape and digital recorders for years. I’m both dyslexic and dysgraphic although do type relatively well. I still use them to this day. I’d give one a try.
Digital voice recorders are a bit easier to use as there’s no rewinding to find a place on a tape.
Carol,
Do you know about mind-mapping? Here’s one (of many) places you can find out about it:
http://www.thinksmart.com/mission/workout/mindmapping_1.html
It may inspire other ideas about how to customize ways he can organize his thoughts. If he’s visual, then different colors and various manipulatives, pictures, etc might help.
Thanks Richard and Emily, for your suggestions. I’ll contiue to suggest an AT eval again. We just had his IEP update today, but the school isn’t very accomodating. They just said that the AT teacher has not recommended any new tech items. His last AT eval was early in the year when my son was refusing to keyboard. So, the school is not considering new tech at this time. Richard, the use of digital voice recorder might be useful, (if I can get the school to cooperate) however, along with the perseverating he does when writing, he also perseverates with speech, so that can be frustrating as well. Emily, I’ll look at the article on mind mapping to see if it might help, but I haven’t had a chance yet.
The school is looking to get him out of there and at the IEP meeting today, they had planned to present info about a dedicated Asperger’s classroom at a different school, however, I don’t want to have him make another change this year, and told them about our (my husband and my) intention to transfer him next year. In the meantime, several of the school district’s people became aware that the IEP accomodations haven’t been done and that new ones need to be added before they can force the issue. Thank goodness for the woman we hire as a school advocate for our son and us. My feeling is that the school was trying to railroad us into making the change, but I feel good about our ability to advocate for Gregory’s needs. since this worked, I’m thinking of ways to insist on a new AT eval.
Thanks “y’all” for letting me vent and especially for the suggestions.
I’m back, again…Thanks Emily, I am aware of this technique. The concept was called “webbing” by the person who told us about it, but Gregory won’t even put pen to paper to do this task except under duress or extreme coercion and/or bribery on a good day.
Carol: like Emily, I’m also a huge fan of outlining and webbing or mind mapping (graphical outlining) with the program Inspiration. However, the way to move forward to is familiarize youself with all of these tools and then try one or two for enough time so they become familiar and comfortable. It make take some support at first and then some weaning from the support. My wife used to “drive” the computer while getting the ideas out of her students, then, over time, she put the students in the driver’s seat so they could drive and she supported their spelling and vocabulary choices. Then she’s get busy with something else letting them alone and finally they were on their own with only occassional shouts for help. This process can take some time and it’s important for your son to stick with it and for you to not toss in the towel too soon. We’re talking months if not a year here. However, in the long run any of these techniques/tools can make a big difference.
If you have questions or come up with a particular set of tools that work for him please come back and share them here, we’d love to hear about them.
Thanks.
As a Student with dysgraphia (and the VMI of a 6 year old), I feel that the alphasmart is not a very good machine for multiple reasons. I used it for 7th and 8th grade (I’m a senior in HS now)
1. It has way too little space.
2. Not very customizable
3. The keyboard layout leaves things to be desired
4. The screen is very small
A laptop is just more versatile than an alphasmart will ever be.
CM, I respect your opinion and agree that a laptop is a great tool but when one needs an inexpensive, simpler alternative, the AlphaSmart or Neo may be just the thing.
I’m dysgraphic as well and have loved using both AlphaSmart and Neo for over ten years now. I have a very high end laptop that I use as well but it’s not always appropriate to use it everywhere and the battery doesn’t last nearly as long as the AlphaSmart.
1. It has way too little space.
One could write a novel on an AlphaSmart. Many professional writers do. Surely that’s enough space for most students.
2. Not very customizable
True, but it’s not a computer. It does a few things simply and well. Turn it on, write, turn it off.
3. The keyboard layout leaves things to be desired
It’s a standard QWERTY layout. The touch on the keyboard may not be what you’re used to but I touch type and the layout works just like my computer.
4. The screen is very small
This is true, but if you pass on the real editing for the computer, the screen is adequate for the writing part of the writing process.
I’ve found that people dislike these products when they try to use them as direct replacements to computers, but when thought of as portable keyboards only, many people understand their usefulness.
My son has been diagnosed with Asperger’s and with dysgraphic. At the beginning of each school year he does great and then when the break for Winter Break over the Holiday’s he regresses. He doesn’t want to use the AlphaSmart(keyboard) and his hand writing is terrible. I feel sorry and I am very blessed that his teachers really try to read what he writes.
I wish I was financially capable of purchasing him his own labtop to take back and forth to school if I thought that was the problem.
Any suggestions on where we might go to help him with his handwriting etc
Thanks for listening
Nancy,
I’m sorry to hear you’re frustrated. Something to keep in mind is that I’m 56 and continue to have terrible handwriting but it doesn’t inhibit my ability to express myself in writing, only my ability to do it with a pen or pencil. So, my advice, as above is to continue to help him work on his handwriting at the same time that you search for technological work-arounds like computers and AlphaSmart or Neo keyboards.
Is the reason he doesn’t want to use the AlphaSmart because he thinks it makes him look stupid? A laptop might make him look more sophisticated, smarter? Is that it? Or is there something else about the AlphaSmart he’s not liking?
You might mention to him that I use an AlphaSmart from time to time and many professional writers use it in addition to their computers because of it’s long battery life, durability, and simplicity. Of course, none of us is young enough to care much about how we look using it, but still, you might mention that.
In short, push both handwriting and keyboarding so he can continue to slowly improve the former while using the latter to get his work done.
I was diagnoes with dysgraphia late in life and my first school had never heard of it instead i was given hours of extra help with my handwriting but still to no prevail, all it seemed to do was get my frustrated and angry, however as soon as i was taught to use a computer and to touch type it made everything so much easier.
Stephen, well said. That is exactly my experience. I started using a computer as a writing tool in the late 1970s and I never looked back. Now writing is relatively easy for me and I don’t dread it at all.
We are in the process of figuring out what to do to help our sone with his dysgraphia. There is a big standardized writing test coming up this year (he’s in 4th grade), and it really is necessary that he keyboard or dictate his composition- if you don’t pass, you repeat the school year, regardless of your grades! I have appreciated reading this (is thread the right term?), and although I think an Alphasmart is probably the more sensible choice, my son is concerned about his rep at school. His writing really does look like a not very bright 4 year old, and he’s reading on a high school level. Anyway, I think our solution is going to be a netbook computer. It’s a small laptop, about half again as expensive as an Alphasmart, but cheaper than a full size, and it’s solid state (the one we are getting anyway) so it is sturdier and since it is smaller, way lighter and hopefully easier to manage at his desk. The coolness factor will doubtless make it harder for his teacher, but she is great and will share our desire to make this work for our son. Just thought I’d chime in to add netbooks to the list of devices that might be helpful for folks with dysgraphia. In my reading about all of this, i have been reading that older students shouldn’t be required to take notes, as it actually can interfere with learning. My poor older son (he’s 13) has 4 interactive notebooks he is required to keep for core subjects, and they are the bane of his existence. They have required content- it isn’t up to the students to decide what they need help remembering. The notebooks are graded, and the pages are numbered. Each page is supposed to contain certain information, AND it must be legible. THE HORROR! I have insisted that teachers not deduct points for handwriting, but he has had to redo pages. He is doing OK with it, definitely sees it as a waste of time and for him it is, he’s a great student and just remembers it all. It really is a nightmare of a dysgraphic, biut on the other hand if he can do it (though sometimes just barely), it seems like he should have to deal… what do you all think?
Gail: I can’t speak to the “netbook” idea because I don’t have one but yes, any kind of electronic writing tool with a keyboard will certainly help.
It won’t, however, help when your son has to keep a notebook with drawings and other types of things.
The best way to tackle this kind of stuff is head on and I’d recommend helping your son slow down when doing these kinds of notebook assignments. Slowing down will help him think ahead and keep things tidy. Also, rehearsal on scrap paper will take the pressure off.
My handwriting is a problem and I’m 57 and to this day, when I need to sign an important document I rehearse my signature on scrap paper.